The Politics Thread

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby NOLA » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:14 pm

U.S. destroyer to pass islands in South China Sea within 24 hours - CNN
https://apple.news/AZjpvWcW5SCOqZrjSS8a2BA

The posturing is getting interesting.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Sammy Sofa » Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:37 pm

Eh; both sides do this a lot. This is mostly a response to the Chinese ships that were chugging around Alaska when Obama was visiting up there.

The latter actually has much more interesting implications; global warming is basically going to up a new northern sailing passage through the north pole and the US, China and Russia are going to be in a race to try and control it. The US has, like a whopping two icebreaker ships vs. Russia having a bunch, so who knows if Obama's call to build more last month will actually work out.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby UK » Tue Oct 27, 2015 7:01 am

Is it wrong that Im generally disgusted at Hillary and find her pretty disgraceful as a politician.

Her recent attacks on Sanders as a sexist and going back to Obama maybe being from Kenya.

Id hate to vote for the lesser case of evil.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Banedon » Tue Oct 27, 2015 7:13 am

Link on the Obama/Kenya thing?

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Tue Oct 27, 2015 7:41 am

Banedon wrote:Link on the Obama/Kenya thing?


It was "Clinton supporters" that first spread the rumors and that turned into criticism of her campaign for birthing the birther movement.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby UK » Tue Oct 27, 2015 7:48 am

Banedon wrote:Link on the Obama/Kenya thing?


Clinton on whether or not Obama is a muslim...

http://dailycaller.com/2015/02/21/flash ... as-i-know/

As Goony mentioned, it was brought up by a Clinton supporter and not refuted by Clinton.

Then there's this...

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc ... 008/37952/

Seeing her passive aggressively link Sanders to being sexist is the same ole [expletive].

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Banedon » Tue Oct 27, 2015 8:07 am

Oh, I thought you meant something more recent with the Obama thing. Poor reading skills on my part.

And yeah, I read about the Sanders thing. This article pretty much shuts that down, not that it will stop her.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_ ... lt_to.html

But yeah, she bothers me. Obviously, she's better than anyone the GOP has nominated, but it wouldn't be a very passionate vote for me.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Exile on Waveland » Tue Oct 27, 2015 9:34 am

She also said something akin to "I'm the candidate for hard-working, white America" while running against Obama.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Banedon » Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:51 am

Derwood wrote:http://www.bostonglobe.com/news/politics/2015/10/26/trump/0zMqF3cIfYrYGX5q1a3pTJ/story.html?event=event25

This guy is leading the polls. LEADING THE POLLS


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Republican presidential candidate Ben Carson has moved ahead of real estate magnate Donald Trump, taking first place in the Republican presidential field in a new CBS/New York Times national poll released Tuesday.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Sammy Sofa » Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:10 pm

UK wrote:
Banedon wrote:Link on the Obama/Kenya thing?


Clinton on whether or not Obama is a muslim...

http://dailycaller.com/2015/02/21/flash ... as-i-know/

As Goony mentioned, it was brought up by a Clinton supporter and not refuted by Clinton.

Then there's this...

http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/arc ... 008/37952/

Seeing her passive aggressively link Sanders to being sexist is the same ole [expletive].


Pretty much all of the major fearmongering against Obama in the run-up to the 2008 election was created or spearheaded by the Clintons.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Tue Oct 27, 2015 1:43 pm

Tim wrote:"Hawthorne Effect". Basically, people improve their behavior if they know they're being watched. I'm a competitive cur, so having friends that are also doing it drives me to want to "win" daily/weekly challenges and such.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Tue Oct 27, 2015 5:06 pm

I knew there was a reason I liked Kasich best out of the GOP field. He'll be a RINO now though!! Hope he enjoyed his political career.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby USSoccer » Wed Oct 28, 2015 8:39 am

Sounds like someone just had his Mogatu moment.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Derwood » Wed Oct 28, 2015 8:21 pm

Watching a panel of GOP candidates pretending to care about the poor and middle class was almost too much to bear

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby kujay » Thu Oct 29, 2015 8:01 am

I watched quite a bit of it for entertainment value. Trump let me down.

Rubio is the only not-crazy one with a reasonable chance to win. And he's pretty extreme too.

I'm scared of Cruz -- people need to see through that guy. He's dangerous.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Oct 29, 2015 8:38 am

I was actually pretty surprised. There was a pretty populist message being delivered for much of the debate from most candidates. It was very light on specifics though.

Watched some of the other news channels after the debate and one of the biggest talking points was about how bad CNBC was, lol. I think some of their line of questioning is justified, however the moment with the female moderator where she asked Trump where she read his quote was cringeworthy. And then she brought it back up like 30 minute later once she actually had the source. Um prepare much?
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Oct 29, 2015 8:41 am

Also sounds like Rubio is the consensus winner. He just makes the most sense from an establishment side, which is funny because he actually rode a wave of Tea Party support. I do wonder if his relatibe lack of experience will come up if he starts to rise though. Junior senator... Not even done with his first term...

A lot of support behind the idea Kasich is odds on favorite as a VP candidate among the field. I feel like the VP won't come from this field though.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Thu Oct 29, 2015 10:49 am

Tim wrote:"Hawthorne Effect". Basically, people improve their behavior if they know they're being watched. I'm a competitive cur, so having friends that are also doing it drives me to want to "win" daily/weekly challenges and such.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby DiceMan4221 » Thu Oct 29, 2015 11:05 am

I think that might be his best BLR. The baby stare down and Chaffee facial ticks were amazing.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby NewUserName » Thu Oct 29, 2015 2:34 pm

Derwood wrote:Watching a panel of GOP candidates pretending to care about the poor and middle class was almost too much to bear

I think most of my staunch republican friends are very compassionate people. They just truly believe that a person needs to do things to improve if they want more money. I don't disagree with that thought, but I still understand that improving yourself is easier for some and almost impossible for others. I also understand that a certain amount of jobs are going to be low skilled/low paying no matter what. So even if everyone in the country pulled themselves up by their bootstraps, 25% of the jobs are still going to suck.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Oct 29, 2015 2:59 pm

NewUserName wrote:
Derwood wrote:Watching a panel of GOP candidates pretending to care about the poor and middle class was almost too much to bear

I think most of my staunch republican friends are very compassionate people. They just truly believe that a person needs to do things to improve if they want more money. I don't disagree with that thought, but I still understand that improving yourself is easier for some and almost impossible for others. I also understand that a certain amount of jobs are going to be low skilled/low paying no matter what. So even if everyone in the country pulled themselves up by their bootstraps, 25% of the jobs are still going to suck.

I mean you look at the tax plans and obviously there are tax breaks for the poor. Whether it's a better deal for the poor or rich varies. In looking through these plans though, I think the middle class gets the squeeze most often in these plans.

Now this also only covers their compassion to the extent that it relates to "hard working folks". While they did discuss SS and Medicare, other welfare programs weren't touched on. Yea taxing the working poor less is good and well, but what about when people on the low end aren't even making wages. That's when they basically lose their compassion and basically go into crazy mode over the "moocher class."

And taking all these tax plans into consideration, they still stress wanting to balance the budget. If you want to cut taxes and grow the economy, fine, but let's stop pretending we're gonna balance the budget. Even in the 90s with the help of a tech boom we only balanced the budget by borrowing from the SS trust fund. And when we talk about shrinking the defecit, let's also be real, there has to be cuts to defense.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby Derwood » Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:16 pm

I noticed an interesting angle to many answers in last night's debate: with many issues (equal pay, minimum wage, etc., etc.) they didn't so much claim to be against them, per se, but instead took the "federal government shouldn't get involved" angle. I think it's a clever way to oppose issues that they don't like

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby CubinNY » Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:23 pm

Derwood wrote:I noticed an interesting angle to many answers in last night's debate: with many issues (equal pay, minimum wage, etc., etc.) they didn't so much claim to be against them, per se, but instead took the "federal government shouldn't get involved" angle. I think it's a clever way to oppose issues that they don't like

Especially since the majority of the states are controlled by Republican's.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby CubinNY » Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:24 pm

They won't think it's a state issue when most of the states are controlled by Democrats, if that every happens.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:29 pm

Derwood wrote:I noticed an interesting angle to many answers in last night's debate: with many issues (equal pay, minimum wage, etc., etc.) they didn't so much claim to be against them, per se, but instead took the "federal government shouldn't get involved" angle. I think it's a clever way to oppose issues that they don't like

Lol I think most people will see right through their avoidance on something like minimum wage with an answer like that.

They're employing two strategies I can see that are varying levels of effective;
1- point out an issue that has gotten worse under Obama, or make it sound like an issue got worse without digging too deep. With the equal pay thing, I think Fiorini quoted a stat that women's pay has declined during Obamas presidecy. Well first we need to fact check, especially with Fiorini. Second though, it's not really like Obama has been able to do very much legislatively. So it's less failed librul policies than it is... Same old same old with some variance?
Still this is an effective strategy for the masses.
2- deflect on focus on growing the economy. "I don't want the government to raise wages, I want a strong economy that creates good paying jobs."
So this one definitely sounds good but really comes down to delivering on such big claims. How sure are you that you can deliver strong, consistent and healthy growth. And how sure are you the free hand if the market will guide growth where it's needed. Frankly the historical record isn't kind to this thinking so it's selling a really big hope. But a nice sounding, populist hope.

They basically have to try their best to not come off as the detached investment manager, which they are doing pretty effectively to this point.
Last edited by WrigleyField 22 on Thu Oct 29, 2015 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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