General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Discussion about other teams, non-cubs players, baseball history, sabr vs scouting, etc.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Ding Dong Johnson » Wed Jul 11, 2018 4:34 pm

yeah I think they hit off tees up until 1971 or something
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Regular Show » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:34 pm

TruffleShuffle wrote:

this doesn't seem like a great trend.


I'm worried by this growing trend. Right now I'm not that worried, but if pitchers keep adding velocity and hitters keep striking out at a higher rate something will have to be done down the road.

I really don't want to lower the mound or push it back. I think instituting an automated strike zone that calls balls/strikes far more accurately (hopefully 99%) will help alleviate the problem, but then again I could be wrong. I believe an automated strike zone will favor offense and hurt pitchers.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:39 pm

Any FB over 92 MPH is a ball. Or ban breaking pitches. That’s the fix. Pitchers have gotten so good that the current way to approach hitting is really the only way to go about facing the current day pitching.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:39 pm

Regular Show wrote:
TruffleShuffle wrote:

this doesn't seem like a great trend.


I'm worried by this growing trend. Right now I'm not that worried, but if pitchers keep adding velocity and hitters keep striking out at a higher rate something will have to be done down the road.

I really don't want to lower the mound or push it back. I think instituting an automated strike zone that calls balls/strikes far more accurately (hopefully 99%) will help alleviate the problem, but then again I could be wrong. I believe an automated strike zone will favor offense and hurt pitchers.


What are you worried will happen?
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Regular Show » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:53 pm

Banedon wrote:
Regular Show wrote:
TruffleShuffle wrote:

this doesn't seem like a great trend.


I'm worried by this growing trend. Right now I'm not that worried, but if pitchers keep adding velocity and hitters keep striking out at a higher rate something will have to be done down the road.

I really don't want to lower the mound or push it back. I think instituting an automated strike zone that calls balls/strikes far more accurately (hopefully 99%) will help alleviate the problem, but then again I could be wrong. I believe an automated strike zone will favor offense and hurt pitchers.


What are you worried will happen?


Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:55 pm

Regular Show wrote:Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?


Say it out loud please. That data means nothing on its own.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:55 pm

Regular Show wrote:
Banedon wrote:
Regular Show wrote:
I'm worried by this growing trend. Right now I'm not that worried, but if pitchers keep adding velocity and hitters keep striking out at a higher rate something will have to be done down the road.

I really don't want to lower the mound or push it back. I think instituting an automated strike zone that calls balls/strikes far more accurately (hopefully 99%) will help alleviate the problem, but then again I could be wrong. I believe an automated strike zone will favor offense and hurt pitchers.


What are you worried will happen?


Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?

Who cares if we have fewer roll over GBs to infielders?
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 11, 2018 7:59 pm

Banedon wrote:
Regular Show wrote:Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?


Say it out loud please. That data means nothing on its own.


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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:05 pm

Banedon wrote:
Regular Show wrote:Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?


Say it out loud please. That data means nothing on its own.


It's replacing action in the game with mostly emptiness. It's not just weak groundballs, but singles and doubles and line drives and diving catches and double plays that are turned into K's, BB, and HR. We're the same people who love all the fun stuff Baez does, right? That's the essence of it, action in the game. It is very much an aesthetic preference so there's room to disagree, but we also don't have to be dense about a pretty drastic spike in a short period of time.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Regular Show » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:13 pm

Cubswin11 wrote:
Regular Show wrote:
Banedon wrote:
What are you worried will happen?


Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?

Who cares if we have fewer roll over GBs to infielders?


It's not just that. MLB hitters are talking about how it's getting harder and harder to get base hits and just put the ball in play now. Defensive shifts, better and more detailed scouting reports, probably better catcher framing/presentation hurts them as well.

Right now, offense is fine but I'm worried about down the road if they ever solve this "juiced ball" paradox then HRs should correspondingly drop. I can see strikeouts keep rising to new crazy high levels if pitchers keep throwing harder. I don't see this trend of pitchers throwing harder letting up.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 8:18 pm

Regular Show wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:
Regular Show wrote:
Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?

Who cares if we have fewer roll over GBs to infielders?


It's not just that. MLB hitters are talking about how it's getting harder and harder to get base hits and just put the ball in play now. Defensive shifts, better and more detailed scouting reports, probably better catcher framing/presentation hurts them as well.

Right now, offense is fine but I'm worried about down the road if they ever solve this "juiced ball" paradox then HRs should correspondingly drop. I can see strikeouts keep rising to new crazy high levels if pitchers keep throwing harder. I don't see this trend of pitchers throwing harder letting up.

I mean it’s probably topped out at how hard pitchers can actually throw, the human body can only do so much. There’s certainly more guys throwing harder and that will continue but I don’t think it gets much worse than this from balls in play/pitchers throwing harder.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:32 am

Regular Show wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:
Regular Show wrote:
Do you see the direction of this trend? Can't you infer what is happening or do you need me to say it out loud lol?

Who cares if we have fewer roll over GBs to infielders?


It's not just that. MLB hitters are talking about how it's getting harder and harder to get base hits and just put the ball in play now. Defensive shifts, better and more detailed scouting reports, probably better catcher framing/presentation hurts them as well.

Right now, offense is fine but I'm worried about down the road if they ever solve this "juiced ball" paradox then HRs should correspondingly drop. I can see strikeouts keep rising to new crazy high levels if pitchers keep throwing harder. I don't see this trend of pitchers throwing harder letting up.


But there's been no noticeable downward trend in OBP or runs scored. So I'm not convinced that there's really some grand effect on offense. I'll be worried when that data points to some other offensive stat decrease.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby ScrubMD » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:36 pm

It will balance out because current trends also show that in 10 years all pitchers will be dead.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Sammys Boombox » Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:29 pm

Teams have taken the approach of working counts, which leads to more BB and more K. They have decreased BABIP by shifting. OBP and not making an out are more important than AVG. SLG is more important than AVG. These are true because that’s what the math says.

“Bullpening” works because that what the math says.

Teams are doing these things, and the game looks the way it does, because that is the best way to win ballgames. People who are irritated by this want to make rules to bring the game back to what it was. Only, when exactly is that? The game has looked quite different decade over decade. The game has continually evolved and I think it’s dumb to try to curtail that by adding or changing rules on where players can stand, how often pitching changes can be made, etc.

The only rule I think I would entertain is limiting the roster size. So, maybe you have a 25, 26, 27 man roster, but each day you have healthy scratches so only 20 guys are available that day. That could cut down on the bullpening a bit. You could even open it up to the full roster if the game goes extras.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Sammy Sofa » Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:47 pm

Sammys Boombox wrote:People who are irritated by this want to make rules to bring the game back to what it was.


It's almost like this is a terrible way to approach almost everything...if only I had a better, larger, "real world" example of how much it sucks. I wonnnnnnnnnnnderrrrrrrrrrrrr....
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:57 pm

Tanking is so much worse for the game of baseball than fewer balls in play. Baseball would be much better off if they stopped rewarding cheap ass teams for being cheap ass teams.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Bertz » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:22 pm

Banedon wrote:
Regular Show wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:Who cares if we have fewer roll over GBs to infielders?


It's not just that. MLB hitters are talking about how it's getting harder and harder to get base hits and just put the ball in play now. Defensive shifts, better and more detailed scouting reports, probably better catcher framing/presentation hurts them as well.

Right now, offense is fine but I'm worried about down the road if they ever solve this "juiced ball" paradox then HRs should correspondingly drop. I can see strikeouts keep rising to new crazy high levels if pitchers keep throwing harder. I don't see this trend of pitchers throwing harder letting up.


But there's been no noticeable downward trend in OBP or runs scored. So I'm not convinced that there's really some grand effect on offense. I'll be worried when that data points to some other offensive stat decrease.


There is absolutely a noticeable downward trend in OBP. It's been staved off a bit by the juiced ball, but it's happening. Here's the average MLB slash Line going back 15 years

2003 - .264/.332/.422
2004 - .266/.335/.428
2005 - .264/.330/.419
2006 - .269/.336/.432
2007 - .268/.336/.422
2008 - .264/.333/.416
2009 - .262/.333/.418
2010 - .257/.325/.403
2011 - .255/.320/.399
2012 - .254/.319/.405
2013 - .253/.317/.396
2014 - .251/.314/.386
2015 - .254/.317/.405
2016 - .255/.321/.417
2017 - .255/.324/.426
2018 - .247/.318/.407

The ball got juiced at the ASB of 2015, and unfortunately I don't have splits for that, but in 2014 horsefeathers was getting dire. And you can see this year now that the ball is only sort of juiced, things have taken a significant step back (though admittedly, playing out the rest of July/August will bump that line up a bit more).

I'm in the camp that I'd like to see something done. The two suggestions I've heard that I like the most are moving the mound back and making it so that relievers have to face at least 3 batters before you can make a mid-inning pitching change. Moving the mound back is the big one, I believe it's something like 6 inches equates to 1 MPH of effective velocity. So moving the mound back a foot would essentially return us to the velocity levels from 10 years ago. The other one probably wouldn't move the needle too much on offense, but it'd help some and it'd make games a hell of a lot more watchable.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby ScrubMD » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:22 pm

It wouldn’t really affect balls in play, but I do kind of hate shifting. Makes the game more boring and seems like it could be a very simple fix. Just say 3B/SS can’t begin the play right of the 2B bag, 2B can’t begin to the left. And maybe I just feel this way because the Cubs don’t shift as much as other teams, I don’t know.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Fri Jul 13, 2018 7:37 pm

Grant Brisbee, National Treasure.

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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Derwood » Sun Jul 15, 2018 4:37 am

Royals with a -182 run differential. OOOF
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby soccer10k » Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:05 am

The Marlins had 22 hits against the Nats last Sunday and 20 of them were singles, including the first 19 of the game. The other two were doubles.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Mon Jul 16, 2018 4:15 am

soccer10k wrote:The Marlins had 22 hits against the Nats last Sunday and 20 of them were singles, including the first 19 of the game. The other two were doubles.

Didn't we do this vs the Twins a few weeks ago?
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby soccer10k » Mon Jul 16, 2018 6:01 am

Cubswin11 wrote:
soccer10k wrote:The Marlins had 22 hits against the Nats last Sunday and 20 of them were singles, including the first 19 of the game. The other two were doubles.

Didn't we do this vs the Twins a few weeks ago?


Close to it. Cubs has 20 hits, 17 singles and 3 doubles. First 14 hits of the game were singles.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Bobson Dugnutt » Mon Jul 16, 2018 5:11 pm

Reading this article on the Ringer about trading for rentals, and this part gets a big eye roll from me:

On the other hand, Torres has turned into the best-case-scenario version of himself—there’s no guarantee the Cubs could have turned him into the player he is now with the Yankees, who might be the best in the business at player development. The Cubs have done a good job with their middle infield prospects, but Addison Russell, Javy Báez, and to a lesser extent Ian Happ are very different players than what they were expected to become as teenagers. Still, those three and Kris Bryant are all very good players—it’s not like Chicago has a Torres-shaped hole in its lineup.


https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2018/7/16 ... mor-rental

Yes, the Cubs player development system probably wouldn't have been the right place for Torres to maximize his potential, as evidenced by the disappointments of Addison Russell, Ian Happ, and Javier Baez.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby TBS Playoffs Insider » Mon Jul 16, 2018 5:49 pm

Bobson Dugnutt wrote:Reading this article on the Ringer about trading for rentals, and this part gets a big eye roll from me:

On the other hand, Torres has turned into the best-case-scenario version of himself—there’s no guarantee the Cubs could have turned him into the player he is now with the Yankees, who might be the best in the business at player development. The Cubs have done a good job with their middle infield prospects, but Addison Russell, Javy Báez, and to a lesser extent Ian Happ are very different players than what they were expected to become as teenagers. Still, those three and Kris Bryant are all very good players—it’s not like Chicago has a Torres-shaped hole in its lineup.


https://www.theringer.com/mlb/2018/7/16 ... mor-rental

Yes, the Cubs player development system probably wouldn't have been the right place for Torres to maximize his potential, as evidenced by the disappointments of Addison Russell, Ian Happ, and Javier Baez.


Yeah i read that line a couple times like umm, what
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