General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Discussion about other teams, non-cubs players, baseball history, sabr vs scouting, etc.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:23 pm

Transmogrified Tiger wrote:
Derwood wrote:What's the logistical difference between four 8-team divisions (plus a bunch of wildcards) vs. eight 4-team divisions (a la the NFL) with fewer wildcards?


The big benefit from the 8 team divisions in the proposed schedule is that it takes a big bite out of travel costs. You could do eight 4 team divisions and weight the schedule with games from your division and a sister division for the same result, and the main benefit is about a playoff structure that is less desired(8 teams) or can also be replicated with 4 divisions.

Unless we're switching to buses I think everybody touting He travel cost thing is making stuff up. You are still getting in a plane every 3-9 days. You are still staying in expensive hotels.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Sammys Boombox » Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:50 pm

jersey cubs fan wrote:
Transmogrified Tiger wrote:
Derwood wrote:What's the logistical difference between four 8-team divisions (plus a bunch of wildcards) vs. eight 4-team divisions (a la the NFL) with fewer wildcards?


The big benefit from the 8 team divisions in the proposed schedule is that it takes a big bite out of travel costs. You could do eight 4 team divisions and weight the schedule with games from your division and a sister division for the same result, and the main benefit is about a playoff structure that is less desired(8 teams) or can also be replicated with 4 divisions.

Unless we're switching to buses I think everybody touting He travel cost thing is making stuff up. You are still getting in a plane every 3-9 days. You are still staying in expensive hotels.


I think travel cost probably isn’t a huge deal, but having more games start in your time zone or close to it for TV is a huge deal. There are a handful of teams that would really benefit from this.

Also, the modularity of the schedule really makes it easy to completely remove stupid things like flying to LA from eastern or central time zone for one series and then flying back east right away. Right now trying to fit the current schedule structure in is a nightmare and leads to some really stupid travel during portions of the season.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Sammys Boombox » Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:59 pm

Crazy DH idea. If we scrap AL/NL, what if each team had to declare before each season if their home games would be played with/without a DH?
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:02 pm

Sammys Boombox wrote:Crazy DH idea. If we scrap AL/NL, what if each team had to declare before each season if their home games would be played with/without a DH?


If you're scrapping AL/NL, just pick a ruleset and go with it. DH or not. Consistency across the league is more important to me than whether we have the DH or we don't.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Sammys Boombox » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:07 pm

Banedon wrote:
Sammys Boombox wrote:Crazy DH idea. If we scrap AL/NL, what if each team had to declare before each season if their home games would be played with/without a DH?


If you're scrapping AL/NL, just pick a ruleset and go with it. DH or not. Consistency across the league is more important to me than whether we have the DH or we don't.


I agree. Just a thought. I actually think what would happen is the vast majority would pick DH. Might have some teams without a good DH option that want to decrease AB by some stud DHs in their division. Then after a few years they would just adopt DH across the board.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby javy knows my name » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:13 pm

If they go through all of this trouble and I still have to watch a pitcher hit, imma horsefeathering kill somebody
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:26 pm

jersey cubs fan wrote:
Transmogrified Tiger wrote:
Derwood wrote:What's the logistical difference between four 8-team divisions (plus a bunch of wildcards) vs. eight 4-team divisions (a la the NFL) with fewer wildcards?


The big benefit from the 8 team divisions in the proposed schedule is that it takes a big bite out of travel costs. You could do eight 4 team divisions and weight the schedule with games from your division and a sister division for the same result, and the main benefit is about a playoff structure that is less desired(8 teams) or can also be replicated with 4 divisions.

Unless we're switching to buses I think everybody touting He travel cost thing is making stuff up. You are still getting in a plane every 3-9 days. You are still staying in expensive hotels.


I admittedly haven't done the math, but considering that thought seems to be coming from the direction of MLB/owners, who have the most to lose if that's wrong, and that the difference is really only considered in the context of making up the difference in 3 home games of revenue, I believe it.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:35 pm

javy knows my name wrote:If they go through all of this trouble and I still have to watch a pitcher hit, imma horsefeathering kill somebody

Am I the only one that likes the pitchers hitting? If only because pitchers juicing home runs is really, really, extra cool. Wood, Z, Lester, and Arrieta hitting dingers are very fond memories in my brain.

Here is my lame slippery slope argument: How long would it take after the DH is instituted league-wide until people are clamoring for shortstops to have their ABs covered by guys with Dadbods who can't field?
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:39 pm

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:If they go through all of this trouble and I still have to watch a pitcher hit, imma horsefeathering kill somebody

Am I the only one that likes the pitchers hitting? If only because pitchers juicing home runs is really, really, extra cool. Wood, Z, Lester, and Arrieta hitting dingers are very fond memories in my brain.

Here is my lame slippery slope argument: How long would it take after the DH is instituted league-wide until people are clamoring for shortstops to have their ABs covered by guys with Dadbods who can't field?


1) Pitchers occasionally hitting a homer doesn't make up for all the thousands of terrible AB's that we have to watch.

2) That is a very lame slippery slope argument.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Derwood » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:43 pm

I was an NL purist for a very long time, mostly due to my annoyance of having a sport that is based on players having "two-way" skill sets watered down by "one-way" players, and the myth of the NL having "better strategy". The truth is, most NL managers suck at this strategy and make terrible decisions all of the time
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:44 pm

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:If they go through all of this trouble and I still have to watch a pitcher hit, imma horsefeathering kill somebody

Am I the only one that likes the pitchers hitting? If only because pitchers juicing home runs is really, really, extra cool. Wood, Z, Lester, and Arrieta hitting dingers are very fond memories in my brain.

Here is my lame slippery slope argument: How long would it take after the DH is instituted league-wide until people are clamoring for shortstops to have their ABs covered by guys with Dadbods who can't field?

Pitchers hitting is dumb and I cant wait for the NL to get the DH. As for your latter part, this is MLB we are talking about, they move at glacial pace. Something like that would take decades to implement.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Thu Jun 21, 2018 4:44 pm

Banedon wrote:
JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:If they go through all of this trouble and I still have to watch a pitcher hit, imma horsefeathering kill somebody

Am I the only one that likes the pitchers hitting? If only because pitchers juicing home runs is really, really, extra cool. Wood, Z, Lester, and Arrieta hitting dingers are very fond memories in my brain.

Here is my lame slippery slope argument: How long would it take after the DH is instituted league-wide until people are clamoring for shortstops to have their ABs covered by guys with Dadbods who can't field?


1) Pitchers occasionally hitting a homer doesn't make up for all the thousands of terrible AB's that we have to watch.

2) That is a very lame slippery slope argument.

1) I even enjoy the terrible ABs. It's entertaining in the same way Pro-Am tournaments are.

2)
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:01 pm

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:1) I even enjoy the terrible ABs. It's entertaining in the same way Pro-Am tournaments are.


But...they don't let the amateurs play in majors...

If you wanna see pitchers hit dingers, let them have a some kind of hitting competition during the all star break or something.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby woodchip2153 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:02 pm

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:If they go through all of this trouble and I still have to watch a pitcher hit, imma horsefeathering kill somebody

Am I the only one that likes the pitchers hitting? If only because pitchers juicing home runs is really, really, extra cool. Wood, Z, Lester, and Arrieta hitting dingers are very fond memories in my brain.

Here is my lame slippery slope argument: How long would it take after the DH is instituted league-wide until people are clamoring for shortstops to have their ABs covered by guys with Dadbods who can't field?


I think both leagues should have the same rules. I would prefer there to be no DH, because, I too, like pitchers hitting but that ain't happening.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby woodchip2153 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:05 pm

Banedon wrote:If you wanna see pitchers hit dingers, let them have a some kind of hitting competition during the all star break or something.


That's as bad as his slippery slope argument.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Banedon » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:07 pm

woodchip2153 wrote:
Banedon wrote:If you wanna see pitchers hit dingers, let them have a some kind of hitting competition during the all star break or something.


That's as bad as his slippery slope argument.


Relegating any pitcher batting to some kind of exhibition is as bad as saying that the adoption of the DH will lead to a DH at other positions?

Gonna disagree there.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:12 pm

Banedon wrote:
JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:1) I even enjoy the terrible ABs. It's entertaining in the same way Pro-Am tournaments are.


But...they don't let the amateurs play in majors...

If you wanna see pitchers hit dingers, let them have a some kind of hitting competition during the all star break or something.

...they absolutely let amateurs play in majors. Not Aaron Rodgers amateurs or even Tony Romo amateurs, but amateurs all the same.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:13 pm

I definitely prefer consistency across leagues, but if there was a big desire for a middle ground, I like the proposal where the DH is tied to the SP, so when he exits its NL rules. Gets rid of most the bad at bats while leaving lots of the strategy part.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:14 pm

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:If they go through all of this trouble and I still have to watch a pitcher hit, imma horsefeathering kill somebody


Here is my lame slippery slope argument: How long would it take after the DH is instituted league-wide until people are clamoring for shortstops to have their ABs covered by guys with Dadbods who can't field?

I think it would take an incredibly long time. Probably at least until I'm too old to give a horsefeathers.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:52 pm

The slippery slope argument is a non-starter because no one is as bad at anything in baseball as pitchers are as hitters. Even playing late-career David Ortiz in center field isn't as bad relative to league average as pitchers are at the plate*.

My personal preference is for NL baseball because I'm willing to sacrifice ~2 PA per team to get the increased strategy in the later innings, but I'd rather have both leagues be the same(even if they both have the DH) than the split that we have now.


*This might be an exaggeration but I'm too busy/lazy to look it up.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Tim » Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:18 pm

In isolation, I prefer no DH.

Given the current makeup of the Cubs, I'd like a 26 man roster and a DH, please.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby woodchip2153 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:35 pm

Banedon wrote:
woodchip2153 wrote:
Banedon wrote:If you wanna see pitchers hit dingers, let them have a some kind of hitting competition during the all star break or something.


That's as bad as his slippery slope argument.


Relegating any pitcher batting to some kind of exhibition is as bad as saying that the adoption of the DH will lead to a DH at other positions?

Gonna disagree there.


Yes, they're both terrible attempts to undermine the others arguments, by purposely missing/exaggerating the point.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby champaignchris » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:17 pm

My order of preference would be...

1. Both leagues use no DH.
2. Both leagues use some sort of compromise rule like a “designated pinch hitter” who could bat three times in a game without the player he’s batting for having to come out.
3. Both leagues use the DH

(Big space.)

4. Things stay the same as they are now.

It’s absurd, especially since year round inter-League play began, that the two leagues have different rules. It’s as if the NBA’s Eastern conference had a three point line and the Western conference didn’t.

I know both Leagues going the NL route is a pipe dream. And I don’t have any faith in baseball’s leadership to come up with a creative compromise solution. So I’m pretty resigned to the fact that the DH is coming to the NL. The sooner the better for me.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby Bull » Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:02 pm

champaignchris wrote:My order of preference would be...

1. Both leagues use no DH.
2. Both leagues use some sort of compromise rule like a “designated pinch hitter” who could bat three times in a game without the player he’s batting for having to come out.
3. Both leagues use the DH

(Big space.)

4. Things stay the same as they are now.

It’s absurd, especially since year round inter-League play began, that the two leagues have different rules. It’s as if the NBA’s Eastern conference had a three point line and the Western conference didn’t.

I know both Leagues going the NL route is a pipe dream. And I don’t have any faith in baseball’s leadership to come up with a creative compromise solution. So I’m pretty resigned to the fact that the DH is coming to the NL. The sooner the better for me.

I feel like option two would open the door for Manfred to take other creative liberties with rules of the game.
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Re: General Baseball Chit-Chat Thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:07 pm

Bull wrote:
champaignchris wrote:My order of preference would be...

1. Both leagues use no DH.
2. Both leagues use some sort of compromise rule like a “designated pinch hitter” who could bat three times in a game without the player he’s batting for having to come out.
3. Both leagues use the DH

(Big space.)

4. Things stay the same as they are now.

It’s absurd, especially since year round inter-League play began, that the two leagues have different rules. It’s as if the NBA’s Eastern conference had a three point line and the Western conference didn’t.

I know both Leagues going the NL route is a pipe dream. And I don’t have any faith in baseball’s leadership to come up with a creative compromise solution. So I’m pretty resigned to the fact that the DH is coming to the NL. The sooner the better for me.

I feel like option two would open the door for Manfred to take other creative liberties with rules of the game.

Before you know it, its baseketball.
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