2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings (BA, Fangraphs, BP)

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2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings (BA, Fangraphs, BP)

Postby CubsWin » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:23 pm

MLB.com has their list out.

http://m.mlb.com/prospects/2017?list=chc

Still no Amaya in their top 30...
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby UMFan83 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:35 pm

It's crazy to see a Cubs prospect list with 8 of the first 10 prospects being pitchers.
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby Cubswin11 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:44 pm

UMFan83 wrote:It's crazy to see a Cubs prospect list with 8 of the first 10 prospects being pitchers.

If all you have are pitching prospects do your really have any prospects at all?
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby TomtheBombadil » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:14 pm

UMFan83 wrote:It's crazy to see a Cubs prospect list with 8 of the first 10 prospects being pitchers.


Also the top spot went to a pitcher coming off back to back injury shortened seasons at the A ball levels. The innings he threw this year weren't even so good, and it will have taken him 6 pro seasons to get to AA for his age 23 season next year. He's almost literally the exact opposite of what made for a top Cubs prospect for the past 5 years or so.
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby CubsWin » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:53 pm

Cubswin11 wrote:
UMFan83 wrote:It's crazy to see a Cubs prospect list with 8 of the first 10 prospects being pitchers.

If all you have are pitching prospects do your really have any prospects at all?

I know, right? At least the depth there allows you to hope 1 or 2 of them make good.

Volatility is already high amongst pitching prospects in general, but when you look at those 8 guys it's even higher. De La Cruz hasn't even combined to pitch 100 innings over the last 2 seasons. Albertos, while still young and sheltered innings-wise as he should be, has dealt with some injuries and has only 47 IP as a pro. Alzolay ended his season on the DL. Lange and Little didn't look great in their pro debuts. Hatch stayed healthy but was up and down in High-A and had the injury his sophomore year at Oklahoma State. Clifton imploded this year and Steele just had TJS.

Good lord.
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby CubsWin » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:55 pm

And the Cubs don't have any in the top 100. The Braves have 8.

http://m.mlb.com/prospects/2017/?list=prospects
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Thu Sep 14, 2017 11:59 pm

They're still gonna stick with Young in the top 20 after his .622 OPS in AAA at 24. This is not a list to remotely take seriously.
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby CubsWin » Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:07 am

Ultimately, I disagree with this particular top 30 list and have generally found MLB.com's rankings less informed than others. They still provide scouting information which is helpful to a degree, but the order they place the players in is always off to me. Perhaps they value ceiling differently than I do.

For my tastes, Rucker should be a lot higher than 29th and Amaya should've at least made the list. The uncertain nature of a lot of the Cubs prospects right now leads to a ton of valid variance, but if you're going to include Jeremiah Estrada at 19 then Nelson Velazquez has to at least make the top 30.

I don't expect MLB.com to have paid the same level of attention as many of us do here, but still...
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby CubsWin » Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:07 am

Transmogrified Tiger wrote:They're still gonna stick with Young in the top 20 after his .622 OPS in AAA at 24. This is not a list to remotely take seriously.

Yeah...
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby CaliforniaRaisin » Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:16 am

Transmogrified Tiger wrote:They're still gonna stick with Young in the top 20 after his .622 OPS in AAA at 24. This is not a list to remotely take seriously.


Pierce Johnson has no business on there too.
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby davell » Fri Sep 15, 2017 3:08 am

Our system is bad, no doubt. But, that list is pathetic.
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby CubsWin » Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:18 pm

davell wrote:Our system is bad, no doubt. But, that list is pathetic.

Agreed.

Guys that should be on their but aren't: Zack Short, David Bote, Miguel Amaya, Javier Assad, Nelson Velazquez, and maybe Brailyn Marquez.

Guys that shouldn't be on their but are: Chesny Young, Pierce Johnson, Rob Zastryzny, Jose Paulino, Carlos Sepulveda and maybe Eddy Martinez.
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby CubsWin » Fri Sep 15, 2017 12:35 pm

A valid order is basically impossible to justify, but some combo of:

Albertos
Alzolay
Ademan
Caratini
Lange
Little
De La Cruz
Rucker
Hatch
Amaya
Maples
Tseng
Zagunis
Bote
DJ Wilson
Abbott
Z. Short
Burks
Mills
Underwood
Clifton
Assad
Galindo
Estrada
Velazquez
Hudson
Moreno
K. Thompson
Vosler
Steele
Marquez
Sierra
Camargo
Mekkes
C. Brooks
Romero

...would be in my top 30 (with some of those names not making the list).
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BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby CaliforniaRaisin » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:05 pm

Cubs Top 10 Prospects
1. Aramis Ademan, SS
2. Adbert Alzolay, RHP
3. Jose Albertos, RHP
4. Victor Caratini, C
5. Alex Lange, RHP
6. Oscar De La Cruz, RHP
7. Brendon Little, LHP
8. Thomas Hatch, RHP
9. Jen-Ho Tseng, RHP
10. Nelson Velazquez, OF

BEST TOOLS

Best Hitter for Average: Victor Caratini.
Best Power Hitter: Nelson Velazquez.
Best Strike-Zone Discipline: Mark Zagunis.
Fastest Baserunner: D.J. Wilson.
Best Athlete: D.J. Wilson.
Best Fastball: Dillon Maples.
Best Curveball: Alex Lange.
Best Slider: Dillon Maples.
Best Changeup: Jose Albertos.
Best Control: Jen-Ho Tseng.
Best Defensive Catcher: P.J. Higgins.
Best Defensive INF: Luis Vazquez.
Best INF Arm: Luis Vazquez.
Best Defensive OF: D.J. Wilson.
Best OF Arm: Eddy Martinez.


Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/2 ... TfKizCm.99

Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/2 ... 7w8Yr4E.99
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Re: 2017 Post-Season Prospect Rankings

Postby davell » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:08 pm

http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/2 ... ?amphtml=1

Interesting list from BA....

Ademan, Alzolay, Albertos, Caratini, Lange, de la Cruz, Little, Hatch, Tseng, and Velázquez.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby Tim » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:10 pm

Wow - seven pitchers. What a change from past years.

I can't believe how early they got this out.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby Guancous » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:17 pm

Strange how the top 2 prospects aren't listed anywhere under Top Tools.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby CaliforniaRaisin » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:18 pm

The projected lineup in 2021 is amusing. Between the position players and pitchers, there's one prospect. One position player over 30:

PROJECTED 2021 LINEUP

(Listed with 2021 season age)

C Willson Contreras (29)
1B Anthony Rizzo (31)
2B Javier Baez (28)
3B Kris Bryant (29)
SS Addison Russell (27)
LF Kyle Schwarber 28)
CF Albert Almora (27)
RF Ian Happ (26)
SP Jose Quintana (32)
SP Jon Lester (37)
SP Kyle Hendricks (31)
SP Adbert Alzolay (26)
SP Mike Montgomery (31)
CL Carl Edwards (29)
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby TomtheBombadil » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:01 pm

Pleasant surprise to see Ademan get the top spot. His season was excellent, showed a ton of skills at a very young age. Throw in some weak competition for the system’s top spot....I’d have Albertos, Hatch, and Lange higher, and am not a huge believer in Alzolay’s perceived ceiling if the thinking is still a potential 3 or even 2 starter.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:12 pm

Did scouts just not turn up for Rucker's starts? I continue to be confused why he can't get any love while someone like Hatch is cracking Top 10s.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby Hrubes20 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:20 pm

I just can't put De La Cruz that high. I get that he's got good stuff, but he isn't getting many innings at all. He honestly may already be on a reliever trajectory. I thought the great post-DL 2nd half of D.J. Wilson would have put him a bit higher in a depleted system, but I guess not.

Also hadn't realized that Vazquez was that highly thought of defensively. That's fun.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby sneakypower » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:32 pm

i have quite frankly never heard of Nelson Velasquez before now
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby davell » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:37 pm

sneakypower wrote:i have quite frankly never heard of Nelson Velasquez before now


4th or 5th round pick.(5th, I think) Big power, had some hamstring issues during his HS season in Puerto Rico last year, so underperformed a bit. Healthy now, seems like we got a steal. Was over slotted, slot was 285k and we gave him 400k.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby Hrubes20 » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:44 pm

Transmogrified Tiger wrote:Did scouts just not turn up for Rucker's starts? I continue to be confused why he can't get any love while someone like Hatch is cracking Top 10s.


Rucker is one of those guys that will probably never appeal to scouts. Short RHP without elite velocity or movement, no wipeout secondary, and is a flyball pitcher. Hatch is also a relatively short RHP, but he has the great movement on all of his stuff, while still having solid velocity. His slider can be plus, and he induces tons of groundballs with all of his pitches. I'm a big fan of Hatch, as long as he stays healthy.
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Re: BA's Top 10 Cubs Prospects

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:46 pm

Hrubes20 wrote:
Transmogrified Tiger wrote:Did scouts just not turn up for Rucker's starts? I continue to be confused why he can't get any love while someone like Hatch is cracking Top 10s.


Rucker is one of those guys that will probably never appeal to scouts. Short RHP without elite velocity or movement, no wipeout secondary, and is a flyball pitcher. Hatch is also a relatively short RHP, but he has the great movement on all of his stuff, while still having solid velocity. His slider can be plus, and he induces tons of groundballs with all of his pitches. I'm a big fan of Hatch, as long as he stays healthy.


Rucker is sitting in the 92-93 range IIRC, and his GB% at Myrtle Beach was higher than Hatch's.
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