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Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:56 pm
by CaliforniaRaisin
Box Scores:

Iowa lost 7-4 Box Score

3B D. Bote 1/5, RBI, K, 2 E (throw, fielding)
1B E. Navarro 0/5, RBI, E (1, missed catch)
RF M. Zagunis 2/4, RBI, K
C C. Gimenez 2/4, 2B (2), K
SS R. Court 0/3, 2 K, HBP
SP JH Tseng 5 IP, 7 H, 6 ER, 1 BB, 5 K, 3 HR, 9-3 GO-FO, 96-60 pitches-strikes
RP R. Rosario 2 IP, 3 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 1 K, 1-3 GO-FO
RP S. Simmons 1 IP, 1 H, 1 ER, 1 BB, 1 K, 1-0 GO-FO

Tennessee won 7-2 Box Score

SS Z. Short 1/4, R, 2 RBI, BB, K, SB (1)
LF C. Burks 2/4, R, RBI, BB, 2 K, SB (1)
3B J. Vosler 0/5, 2 K
RF E. Martinez 1/4, R, BB, SB (4)
C I. Rice 1/4, R, 2B (2), BB, K
SP T. Clifton 5 IP, 1 H, 0 R, 1 BB, 5 K, 1 HBP, 5-2 GO-FO, 75-47 pitches-strikes
RP C. Brooks 2 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 1 BB, 0 K, 2-1 GO-FO
RP D. Mekkes 1.1 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 1 K, 1 WP, 1-2 GO-FO

Myrtle Beach lost 3-0 Box Score

CF DJ Wilson 0/3, BB, 2 K
DH PJ Higgins 0/4, 2 K
3B W. Galindo 0/3, K
1B T. Alamo 0/3, 2 K
KF J. Mitchell 1/3, SB (4)
C J. Pereda 0/3
SS A. Monsaterio 0/3, K
SP M. Swarmer 5 IP, 4 H, 1 ER, 1 BB, 8 K, 3-1 GO-FO, 73-52 pitches-strikes

South Bend had the day off

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 11:11 pm
by Transmogrified Tiger
Rucker went 3 (uninspiring) innings before Tennessee was rained out, so I would guess he’s not gonna go again tomorrow.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 11:32 pm
by craig
Ademan has K'd over 40% of his AB. Obviously early and small sample, but at this point I wonder if his hitting development might not have been better served with a South Bend assignment. Probably makes no difference, though.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:29 am
by TomtheBombadil
craig wrote:Ademan has K'd over 40% of his AB. Obviously early and small sample, but at this point I wonder if his hitting development might not have been better served with a South Bend assignment. Probably makes no difference, though.


He's also got a .167 IsoSLG that was .194 coming into the day. It's proooobably a little soon to hit a panic button.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:01 am
by davell
I'm not worried about K rates with Ademan yet. Nor am I going to take his SLG rates seriously either. But, I do think he's a top 50ish prospect by the end of the year.

And a very nice lead piece to pair with Heyward, to unload his contract, in the offseason.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 1:19 am
by Cubswin11
davell wrote:I'm not worried about K rates with Ademan yet. Nor am I going to take his SLG rates seriously either. But, I do think he's a top 50ish prospect by the end of the year.

And a very nice lead piece to pair with Heyward, to unload his contract, in the offseason.

I’m hoping we don’t need to get rid of anyone prospects to trade a contract this offseason and just can pay Bryce and not worry about money.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:55 am
by CaliforniaRaisin
Transmogrified Tiger wrote:Rucker went 3 (uninspiring) innings before Tennessee was rained out, so I would guess he’s not gonna go again tomorrow.


Whoops. Fixed.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:02 am
by TomtheBombadil
Cubswin11 wrote:
davell wrote:I'm not worried about K rates with Ademan yet. Nor am I going to take his SLG rates seriously either. But, I do think he's a top 50ish prospect by the end of the year.

And a very nice lead piece to pair with Heyward, to unload his contract, in the offseason.

I’m hoping we don’t need to get rid of anyone prospects to trade a contract this offseason and just can pay Bryce and not worry about money.


Has there been any trade where a team included probably their top prospect to move on from a contract?

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:05 am
by TomtheBombadil
Cubswin11 wrote:
davell wrote:I'm not worried about K rates with Ademan yet. Nor am I going to take his SLG rates seriously either. But, I do think he's a top 50ish prospect by the end of the year.

And a very nice lead piece to pair with Heyward, to unload his contract, in the offseason.

I’m hoping we don’t need to get rid of anyone prospects to trade a contract this offseason and just can pay Bryce and not worry about money.


Has there been any trade where a team included probably their top prospect to move on from a contract? That seems like the opposite of something this FO would do even if some other team has done it before.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:15 am
by davell
TomtheBombadil wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:
davell wrote:I'm not worried about K rates with Ademan yet. Nor am I going to take his SLG rates seriously either. But, I do think he's a top 50ish prospect by the end of the year.

And a very nice lead piece to pair with Heyward, to unload his contract, in the offseason.

I’m hoping we don’t need to get rid of anyone prospects to trade a contract this offseason and just can pay Bryce and not worry about money.


Has there been any trade where a team included probably their top prospect to move on from a contract?


Probably not. But I don't remember Arizona's system when they moved Touki with Arroyo.

At any rate, I think they'll do their best to move Heyward, for Bryce. And it's take Ademan plus other solid prospects to get a team to eat most of that deal.

And I think the FO would jump at doing it actually. Because it'd also allow for another decent sized move to stay under the max LT penalties. Prospects are just currency at this point and can be used in any manner to help the ML team.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:42 am
by TomtheBombadil
davell wrote:Probably not. But I don't remember Arizona's system when they moved Touki with Arroyo.

At any rate, I think they'll do their best to move Heyward, for Bryce. And it's take Ademan plus other solid prospects to get a team to eat most of that deal.

And I think the FO would jump at doing it actually. Because it'd also allow for another decent sized move to stay under the max LT penalties. Prospects are just currency at this point and can be used in any manner to help the ML team.


Edited in my last post but this seems like the opposite of what the FO would do just to get out of some money. They're a little more than a year out from having more money than they can spend if everything goes as expected with the media rights up for sale.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:07 pm
by davell
TomtheBombadil wrote:
davell wrote:Probably not. But I don't remember Arizona's system when they moved Touki with Arroyo.

At any rate, I think they'll do their best to move Heyward, for Bryce. And it's take Ademan plus other solid prospects to get a team to eat most of that deal.

And I think the FO would jump at doing it actually. Because it'd also allow for another decent sized move to stay under the max LT penalties. Prospects are just currency at this point and can be used in any manner to help the ML team.


Edited in my last post but this seems like the opposite of what the FO would do just to get out of some money. They're a little more than a year out from having more money than they can spend if everything goes as expected with the media rights up for sale.


Don't see them or ANY team heading into the draft pick loss section of the luxury tax, no matter how much money they can afford to spend. Theo especially, since he may have designs on the commissioner gig himself, at some stage. MLB doesn't want teams exploiting that and I don't see teams doing it.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:54 pm
by CaliforniaRaisin

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:00 pm
by TomtheBombadil
davell wrote:Don't see them or ANY team heading into the draft pick loss section of the luxury tax, no matter how much money they can afford to spend. Theo especially, since he may have designs on the commissioner gig himself, at some stage. MLB doesn't want teams exploiting that and I don't see teams doing it.


It’s hard to imagine Epstein giving up likely his top prospect to dump a salary over a commissioner’s job that may not be available for another twenty+ years.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:04 am
by davell
TomtheBombadil wrote:
davell wrote:Don't see them or ANY team heading into the draft pick loss section of the luxury tax, no matter how much money they can afford to spend. Theo especially, since he may have designs on the commissioner gig himself, at some stage. MLB doesn't want teams exploiting that and I don't see teams doing it.


It’s hard to imagine Epstein giving up likely his top prospect to dump a salary over a commissioner’s job that may not be available for another twenty+ years.


The commish job is not THE reason. The true point is Hayward sucks, is paid lots of money, and moving his salary off the books will give us a bunch of added flexibility. It would take Ademan plus to move him. But, the added draft picks, plus the IFA class additions, should allow us to move a few guys......

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 12:28 am
by TomtheBombadil
davell wrote:The commish job is not THE reason. The true point is Hayward sucks, is paid lots of money, and moving his salary off the books will give us a bunch of added flexibility. It would take Ademan plus to move him. But, the added draft picks, plus the IFA class additions, should allow us to move a few guys......


Well first the commisioner thing isn't a reason at all. From there even if the bold were true, and it's probably not, giving away cheap talent to save money they have is not something this FO has ever done. They just do no act so desperately, I don't expect them to start. Hell, no one dumps their likely top prospect to dump a contract. If there's any comparable to Toussaint in the org, a mediocre and still probably the best and biggest name prospect traded in a salary dump, it's Albertos.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 1:50 am
by Jaxbro
Holy crap!!! 5 shutout innings of one hit one walk ball for Trevor Clifton. Struck out 5 on 75 pitches. 5-2 ground/fly outs.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:02 am
by davell
TomtheBombadil wrote:
davell wrote:The commish job is not THE reason. The true point is Hayward sucks, is paid lots of money, and moving his salary off the books will give us a bunch of added flexibility. It would take Ademan plus to move him. But, the added draft picks, plus the IFA class additions, should allow us to move a few guys......


Well first the commisioner thing isn't a reason at all. From there even if the bold were true, and it's probably not, giving away cheap talent to save money they have is not something this FO has ever done. They just do no act so desperately, I don't expect them to start. Hell, no one dumps their likely top prospect to dump a contract. If there's any comparable to Toussaint in the org, a mediocre and still probably the best and biggest name prospect traded in a salary dump, it's Albertos.


Lol. Touki was sent with a SINGLE year of Arroyo. Think it was around 14 mill total. That's what a guy like Touki brings. It's 106 mill of Heyward. That's going to cost a HELL of a lot more than that. Anyway, I'm done talking about it.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:22 am
by Bobson Dugnutt
Didn’t AZ get destroyed by pretty much everyone when they made that deal though?

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:35 am
by Cubswin11
How hard would it even be to get under the LT in 2 years after Zobrist, Morrow and Lester are all off the books, that’s over $50 million between the 3? Hopefully we just suck it up and take the LT hit the next 2 years and get under/reset the year after that.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:39 am
by CaliforniaRaisin
CaliforniaRaisin wrote:


https://www.thecubreporter.com/04162018 ... -riverview

Brailyn Marquez and Jeremiah Estrada combined to strike out seven of the first 11 men they faced, and seven pitchers combined to toss a five-hitter

...

RHPs Fernando Calderon, Benjamin Rodriguez, and Jose M. Gonzalez made their U. S. debut in today's game, working one inning a piece. All three pitched in the DSL last year.

Not counting pitchers who are rehabbing at Extended Spring Training, Marquez and Estrada are clearly the Cubs top two pitching prospects at EXST, and the duo will likely be at the top of the Eugene starting rotation when the NWL begins play in June.


1. Brailyn Marquez: 2.0 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 4 K, 1 WP, 0/3 GO/AO, 33 pitches (19 strikes)
2. Jeremiah Estrada: 1.1 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 4 BB, 3 K, 1 WP, 0/1 GO/AO, 39 pitches (16 strikes)

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:41 am
by davell
Bobson Dugnutt wrote:Didn’t AZ get destroyed by pretty much everyone when they made that deal though?


They did. But, a team isn't taking on a 100 mill, without getting something very good in return. And for these next few years, I think there's going to be a decent amount of these deals. Because I don't see a single team going into the highest penalty box of the LT.(even if it makes more sense for them to do it)

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:49 am
by davell
Cubswin11 wrote:How hard would it even be to get under the LT in 2 years after Zobrist, Morrow and Lester are all off the books, that’s over $50 million between the 3? Hopefully we just suck it up and take the LT hit the next 2 years and get under/reset the year after that.


Oh, we're going to go over. Next year. We're just not going to hit the 40+ mill overage penalty box. Losing those guys helps obviously, but arb raises will eat into that a ton honestly.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:34 am
by Regular Show
CaliforniaRaisin wrote:
CaliforniaRaisin wrote:


https://www.thecubreporter.com/04162018 ... -riverview

Brailyn Marquez and Jeremiah Estrada combined to strike out seven of the first 11 men they faced, and seven pitchers combined to toss a five-hitter

...

RHPs Fernando Calderon, Benjamin Rodriguez, and Jose M. Gonzalez made their U. S. debut in today's game, working one inning a piece. All three pitched in the DSL last year.

Not counting pitchers who are rehabbing at Extended Spring Training, Marquez and Estrada are clearly the Cubs top two pitching prospects at EXST, and the duo will likely be at the top of the Eugene starting rotation when the NWL begins play in June.


1. Brailyn Marquez: 2.0 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 0 BB, 4 K, 1 WP, 0/3 GO/AO, 33 pitches (19 strikes)
2. Jeremiah Estrada: 1.1 IP, 0 H, 0 R, 4 BB, 3 K, 1 WP, 0/1 GO/AO, 39 pitches (16 strikes)


That's awesome to read about. I really liked Estrada in last year's draft and I'm glad he fell to the Cubs. If that plus changeup is back and he can command it I'm not too worried about the curveball. I remember even reading some scouting reports that mentioned how it might develop into a plus-plus changeup in time.

Re: Minor League Discussion & Boxes, 4-16-18

Posted: Tue Apr 17, 2018 8:47 am
by TomtheBombadil
There's still zero precedent for that kind of deal where an org gives up proooobably their top prospect to dump a salary. There has, OTOH, been Heyward sized dumps (the Red Sox/Dodgers trade, Rockies/Jays, Stanton). Teams like the Phillies and Braves have tons to spend and little to spend on, and Heyward was a good player for a long time still being moved in his 20's so most likely if anything the Cubs are padding his deal with their overstuffed low minors pitching (Albertos, Estrada, Marquez, all those former college turned org arms). Even then the Cubs have the money to just eat Heyward's situation and pay Harper without really throwing anything off, let alone giving away from the top of their prospect pile.