Politics & Current Events

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:53 am

The average voter on either side is still mostly reached by TV. So far TLP is taking the path trod trod by Russian hackers and the like; for all of the hooplah over social media shenanigans in trying to sway elections, it's an outlet that is still dwarfed by TV.

And the only thing stopping TLP from being all over TV is TLP. If they start throwing their money into that, or even into Democratic candidates, fine, then I'm wrong. But until then, all they're ultimately doing is making propaganda for an audience that already agrees with them, raking in money, and setting themselves to be "the respectable Republicans" after this all shakes out.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Ding Dong Johnson » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:58 am

They bring all of the pain.

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:59 am

Sammy Sofa wrote:The average voter on either side is still mostly reached by TV. So far TLP is taking the path trod trod by Russian hackers and the like; for all of the hooplah over social media shenanigans in trying to sway elections, it's an outlet that is still dwarfed by TV.

And the only thing stopping TLP from being all over TV is TLP. If they start throwing their money into that, or even into Democratic candidates, fine, then I'm wrong. But until then, all they're ultimately doing is making propaganda for an audience that already agrees with them, raking in money, and setting themselves to be "the respectable Republicans" after this all shakes out.

Well no matter their motivations, they are the respectable Republicans right now. I'm not gonna lose too much sleep over the fact that it may be self preservation when we have 52 non-respectable republican Senators.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:08 am

WrigleyField 22 wrote:
Sammy Sofa wrote:The average voter on either side is still mostly reached by TV. So far TLP is taking the path trod trod by Russian hackers and the like; for all of the hooplah over social media shenanigans in trying to sway elections, it's an outlet that is still dwarfed by TV.

And the only thing stopping TLP from being all over TV is TLP. If they start throwing their money into that, or even into Democratic candidates, fine, then I'm wrong. But until then, all they're ultimately doing is making propaganda for an audience that already agrees with them, raking in money, and setting themselves to be "the respectable Republicans" after this all shakes out.

Well no matter their motivations, they are the respectable Republicans right now. I'm not gonna lose too much sleep over the fact that it may be self preservation when we have 52 non-respectable republican Senators.


I genuinely don't understand this; do you think the type of candidates people like them would endorse/fund wouldn't be awful? It's a respectability that's simply a mask. Their goal is to try their damndest to have the GOP survive and rebound post-Trump. It's not some kind of new Republican; it's little more than trying to push back the clock to the Republicans from about 20 years ago. Those guys still really, really horsefeathering sucked!

Yeah, everyone here is loving these ads because they're being made at us.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:17 am

Who is the us in this case?
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby NOLA » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:19 am

Sammy Sofa wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:
Sammy Sofa wrote:The average voter on either side is still mostly reached by TV. So far TLP is taking the path trod trod by Russian hackers and the like; for all of the hooplah over social media shenanigans in trying to sway elections, it's an outlet that is still dwarfed by TV.

And the only thing stopping TLP from being all over TV is TLP. If they start throwing their money into that, or even into Democratic candidates, fine, then I'm wrong. But until then, all they're ultimately doing is making propaganda for an audience that already agrees with them, raking in money, and setting themselves to be "the respectable Republicans" after this all shakes out.

Well no matter their motivations, they are the respectable Republicans right now. I'm not gonna lose too much sleep over the fact that it may be self preservation when we have 52 non-respectable republican Senators.


I genuinely don't understand this; do you think the type of candidates people like them would endorse/fund wouldn't be awful? It's a respectability that's simply a mask. Their goal is to try their damndest to have the GOP survive and rebound post-Trump. It's not some kind of new Republican; it's little more than trying to push back the clock to the Republicans from about 20 years ago. Those guys still really, really horsefeathering sucked!

Yeah, everyone here is loving these ads because they're being made at us.

Im loving them because I hope the Left sees how to make an ad campaign. Of course they’re Lee Atwater, Karl Rove level awful.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:21 am

WrigleyField 22 wrote:Who is the us in this case?


The regular posters in this thread, who pretty clearly almost all fall to varying degrees on the Left.

(Don't horsefeathering ignore that "almost," you scattered self-loathing mutts)
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:21 am

NOLA wrote:
Sammy Sofa wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:Well no matter their motivations, they are the respectable Republicans right now. I'm not gonna lose too much sleep over the fact that it may be self preservation when we have 52 non-respectable republican Senators.


I genuinely don't understand this; do you think the type of candidates people like them would endorse/fund wouldn't be awful? It's a respectability that's simply a mask. Their goal is to try their damndest to have the GOP survive and rebound post-Trump. It's not some kind of new Republican; it's little more than trying to push back the clock to the Republicans from about 20 years ago. Those guys still really, really horsefeathering sucked!

Yeah, everyone here is loving these ads because they're being made at us.

Im loving them because I hope the Left sees how to make an ad campaign. Of course they’re Lee Atwater, Karl Rove level awful.


These seems like wanting to hammer a nail with a horsefeathering car.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:23 am

Sammy Sofa wrote:
Yeah, everyone here is loving these ads because they're being made at us.

...are you looking behind your back for someone to shout "gotcha"!

What is the goal, the big trick, you think they are trying to play on us? To get money from us? To convince us of what we already know about Trump? Like, for me, the end game is going to be "oh wow, those Republicans crapping on Trump are still Republicans without Trump!?". Thanks to your warnings...oh, your warnings are about absolutely nothing we don't already know.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Derwood » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:36 am

These ads are already on TV, just not in high volume. I've seen several of them in primetime
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:36 am

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:
Sammy Sofa wrote:
Yeah, everyone here is loving these ads because they're being made at us.

...are you looking behind your back for someone to shout "gotcha"!

What is the goal, the big trick, you think they are trying to play on us? To get money from us? To convince us of what we already know about Trump? Like, for me, the end game is going to be "oh wow, those Republicans crapping on Trump are still Republicans without Trump!?". Thanks to your warnings...oh, your warnings are about absolutely nothing we don't already know.


I....have answered all of these things pretty clearly so far. Yes, their goal so far apparently is to get money, and they've been really, really good at it. They're not actually spending that money on much, including not spending on TV spots. Social media is still the runt of the litter when it comes to reaching large groups of voters, especially the average voter on the Right, so they're seemingly not doing anything except making ads targeted at people who are already inclined to, rightly, go "horsefeathers YEAH" about anything that well made that's anti-Trump...but that doesn't actually accomplish anything outside of getting them likes from the Left...and money from the Left.

So, again, then what point do they serve? Shouldn't it be worrisome that a well-oiled attack Republican attack machine is racking up money from Democratic donors...and not really spending all that much of it?

When people watch these things and say something, like, "man, the Republicans are so much better at this sort of thing," they really don't know the half of it. Why should any of us be cool with a bunch of eternal Republican never-Trumpers taking advantage of the moment to rack up the cash for a Super PAC?
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:40 am

Derwood wrote:These ads are already on TV, just not in high volume. I've seen several of them in primetime


Right, this is all relative. With the money they have behind them and that they're raking in, these should be blasted out there with the volume of all of the other political spots we see a zillion times and get sick of every election cycle. They've bought spots on Fox News, so it's not like they're shut out over there; that pack of jackals will play anything that gives them money.

The point is, as pointed out in the links I included, they don't spend very much of the money they take in. The costs of the ads themselves is minimal, and they don't spend a lot on wide TV coverage. What are they waiting for? People on the Left should not be so quick to give them money.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:41 am

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote: Thanks to your warnings...oh, your warnings are about absolutely nothing we don't already know.

This is where I'm at with it. Like there isn't some big secret cover up. An idiot can pull up their website and see in no uncertain terms that its ran by conservatives. Anyone compelled to give money probably is a moderate person with views that rang center left to center right.

FWIW This site indicates they've raised about 2.5m and have expenditures of 4.5m, as of today's filing. We'll see if they actually build up a war chest in the coming months...
https://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/superpacs.php
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Derwood » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:43 am

The point everyone is missing is that the horsefeathering DEMOCRATS should be making these ads, but they suck at messaging
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:48 am

WrigleyField 22 wrote:
JudasIscariotTheBird wrote: Thanks to your warnings...oh, your warnings are about absolutely nothing we don't already know.

This is where I'm at with it. Like there isn't some big secret cover up. An idiot can pull up their website and see in no uncertain terms that its ran by conservatives. Anyone compelled to give money probably is a moderate person with views that rang center left to center right.

FWIW This site indicates they've raised about 2.5m and have expenditures of 4.5m, as of today's filing. We'll see if they actually build up a war chest in the coming months...
https://www.opensecrets.org/pacs/superpacs.php


Read the Atlantic article; most of money "spent" is technically going to the board members and/or their own companies.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:51 am

Derwood wrote:The point everyone is missing is that the horsefeathering DEMOCRATS should be making these ads, but they suck at messaging


Right, and yet again, rooting for a Republican Super PAC to thrive money-wise by making ads that mostly just appeal to people on the Left seems like a really ass-backwards way to show those stupid ol' Democrats what for.

Like, if you watch the ad and it gets you all revved up, great! But it's not actually going to get the Democrats to do anything ad-wise, and it horsefeathering sucks that anyone who should know better is giving TLP money.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 1:53 am

Okay, but that raised money is also pretty low, no?
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Wed Jul 01, 2020 2:05 am

WrigleyField 22 wrote:Okay, but that raised money is also pretty low, no?


Not for the relatively short time of their existence, IMO.

And again, my assumption is that they're laying the groundwork to be the flag-carriers for the post-Trump GOP recovery. He loses, especially if he loses resoundingly, they get to trumpet how they were on the right side of history early on and now they want to help the party heal or some horsefeathers. If he wins, they just do it again for 4 more years and pick it up after his second term.

I mean, I think they're smart as horsefeathers. As much as I'd like to think the GOP is hastening it's own inevitable lingering demise with the current political climate, it's nerds like this who will nurse it back to health.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:28 am

Sammy Sofa wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:Okay, but that raised money is also pretty low, no?


Not for the relatively short time of their existence, IMO.

And again, my assumption is that they're laying the groundwork to be the flag-carriers for the post-Trump GOP recovery. He loses, especially if he loses resoundingly, they get to trumpet how they were on the right side of history early on and now they want to help the party heal or some horsefeathers. If he wins, they just do it again for 4 more years and pick it up after his second term.

I mean, I think they're smart as horsefeathers. As much as I'd like to think the GOP is hastening it's own inevitable lingering demise with the current political climate, it's nerds like this who will nurse it back to health.

From a Super PAC perspective though the major mainstream conservative pacs will easily be shifting their already established war chests to whatever candidate emerges post Trump already and TLP probably isn't going to take over that as the leaders of the new conservatism. These guys jumping ship early and with frankly, shocking unequivolance, isn't going to overtake the GOP machine.

I feel very confident once all the rest of these GOP stooges finally jump ship it will be done with tons of equivalence and veerry cheap lip service to soul searching or whatever and how they can better communicate their pro-whatever message to America (i.e. When Paul Ryan wondered how he could convince(trick) poor people Republicans didn't hate them). That's a tale as old as republican time. I don't know if TLPs purported brilliance is going to become the standard bearer over that. They can't trick enough solidly left leaning folks of something else, and the center right folks very very likely will fall into line with the establishment over TLP (as they did with Trump round 1).
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Wed Jul 01, 2020 3:58 am

Or take it this way (my own hot take).

For the Lincoln Project to be successful at this presumptive GOP takeover, or whatever it is, the GOP needs to be obliterated. You'll need to see some crazy stuff like McConnel or Graham falling and a solid 4+ Dem senate lead (which would be like a +8 cycle, followed by a strong Dem map in 2022, so a very good chance at 4 years of aligned Dem leadership if they don't trip over their own dicks). Let's just say this is the map and TLP eventually does contribute to more than just Bullock;
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Something like that (with special care given to margins) is universe where TLP is able to construct some hostile takeover of conservatism and pick up some type of dedicated following along the way amongst the center.

I'd personally take that trade over something like a 50-50 senate and the GOP establishment saving enough face to regroup and try to re-message themselves in 2022 and 2024. To the point of the GOP hastened demise, I'd frankly rather speed it up, because some sort of business-friendly conservative establishment party will pick up anyways if that day comes, and the sooner the demise of this current iteration of conservatism the better, frankly.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Wed Jul 01, 2020 4:23 am

Colorado's western slope is represented by a single congressional district. It has flipped back and forth between Dems and Repubs fairly regularly, but has been held by a Republican since 2012. That Republican just lost his primary, out of no where, to a gun rights advocate who owns a gun-themed restaurant in the city of Rifle. And of course, and she's down with QAnon.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby OleMissCub » Wed Jul 01, 2020 5:35 am

Soooo...I guess I’m the only one in here who didn’t realize Lincoln Project was run by Republicans.

Between this and my diarrhea brainshart yesterday about Hillary I might need to seek help. I might be losing some cognitive function.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby SouthSideRyan » Wed Jul 01, 2020 5:46 am

Sammy Sofa wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:
Sammy Sofa wrote:The average voter on either side is still mostly reached by TV. So far TLP is taking the path trod trod by Russian hackers and the like; for all of the hooplah over social media shenanigans in trying to sway elections, it's an outlet that is still dwarfed by TV.

And the only thing stopping TLP from being all over TV is TLP. If they start throwing their money into that, or even into Democratic candidates, fine, then I'm wrong. But until then, all they're ultimately doing is making propaganda for an audience that already agrees with them, raking in money, and setting themselves to be "the respectable Republicans" after this all shakes out.

Well no matter their motivations, they are the respectable Republicans right now. I'm not gonna lose too much sleep over the fact that it may be self preservation when we have 52 non-respectable republican Senators.


I genuinely don't understand this; do you think the type of candidates people like them would endorse/fund wouldn't be awful? It's a respectability that's simply a mask. Their goal is to try their damndest to have the GOP survive and rebound post-Trump. It's not some kind of new Republican; it's little more than trying to push back the clock to the Republicans from about 20 years ago. Those guys still really, really horsefeathering sucked!

Yeah, everyone here is loving these ads because they're being made at us.


They're running ads for Bullock in Montana, and will no doubt be doing the same for McGrath in KY. No doubt you won't care about this because those candidates won't be Dem enough for you.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:17 am

They get more attention on this board than literally anywhere else in the universe
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Wed Jul 01, 2020 6:20 am

OleMissCub wrote:Soooo...I guess I’m the only one in here who didn’t realize Lincoln Project was run by Republicans.

Between this and my diarrhea brainshart yesterday about Hillary I might need to seek help. I might be losing some cognitive function.


It happens. I got out to the car yesterday after lunch. Go through the hassle of getting kid buckled. Sit in the driver's seat. Start trying to find my keys in my pocket, realize I don't feel them. I must have left them on the table at the restaurant. We're right outside, I could run in and get them, leave kid in the car for 20 seconds, he won't care and he's old enough people wouldn't think it was weird. But the car is running so that seems like a little too much risk. It took me a good 10 seconds to realize what I was missing with that scenario.
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