Game of Thrones

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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Tue May 07, 2019 4:55 pm

Chocolate Milk wrote:Let's not give Martin too much credit. He had a shadow baby directly kill one of the main claimants to the throne. Can you imagine if the show runners pulled that horsefeathers? The internet would melt down.

To be fair, birthing an assassin demon baby was made fun of. A lot. And ultimately it resulted in Stannis's death. (The character, not the NSBB poster, presumably)
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Banedon » Tue May 07, 2019 4:56 pm

snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.


Jon was killed and resurrected. Pretty much the ultimate plot armor.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby snoodmonger » Tue May 07, 2019 4:57 pm

You guys must not read a lot of fantasy, because i was like, "Shadowbaby? Sure, I can dig that."
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby muntjack » Tue May 07, 2019 4:57 pm

snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."


All of these things are Benioff and Weiss. To be clear, I've never read the books, I've just felt a steady decline since season 5.

Chocolate Milk wrote:Let's not give Martin too much credit. He had a shadow baby directly kill one of the main claimants to the throne. Can you imagine if the show runners pulled that horsefeathers? The internet would melt down.


Agreed, that was stupid. If GRRM writes in the Beyond the Wall plotline, I will disavow everything positive I've ever said about him. That was the most egregious "let's figure out a way to make this cool thing happen" writing that is hallmark of terrible fiction.

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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Chocolate Milk » Tue May 07, 2019 5:32 pm

snoodmonger wrote:You guys must not read a lot of fantasy, because i was like, "Shadowbaby? Sure, I can dig that."

I've read a totally embarrassing amount of fantasy but that event always seemed out of place to me in this series. The fantastical elements, well the non-dragon ones, were more mystical and somewhat indirect. It just seemed weird that all the sudden she casts a magical spell that has a direct impact on the story.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby javy knows my name » Tue May 07, 2019 5:33 pm

Banedon wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.


Jon was killed and resurrected. Pretty much the ultimate plot armor.


If I'm remembering correctly, one of GRRM's biggest beefs with LOTR (and one of his main reasons for creating his own realm) was because he hated how Gandalf just kinda came back bc Tolkien missed him or whatever. I can't imagine he was happy with that turn, at all.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Tue May 07, 2019 5:36 pm

snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.

This season would be way better if everyone important died in episode 2 and they spent the next 4 episodes detailing the battle of the three kings between Edmure Tully, Wyman Manderly, and some Martell we've never met.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby jersey cubs fan » Tue May 07, 2019 5:43 pm

javy knows my name wrote:
Banedon wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.


Jon was killed and resurrected. Pretty much the ultimate plot armor.


If I'm remembering correctly, one of GRRM's biggest beefs with LOTR (and one of his main reasons for creating his own realm) was because he hated how Gandalf just kinda came back bc Tolkien missed him or whatever. I can't imagine he was happy with that turn, at all.

You think GRRM is upset that GOT brought back Jon Snow?
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Chocolate Milk » Tue May 07, 2019 5:46 pm

WrigleyField 22 wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.

This season would be way better if everyone important died in episode 2 and they spent the next 4 episodes detailing the battle of the three kings between Edmure Tully, Wyman Manderly, and some Martell we've never met.

Lol - I literally saw some post on r/asoiaf that had thousands of upvotes that bemoaning that we didn't know what was going on with Edmure Tully and Robin Arryn.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby javy knows my name » Tue May 07, 2019 5:46 pm

jersey cubs fan wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:
Banedon wrote:
Jon was killed and resurrected. Pretty much the ultimate plot armor.


If I'm remembering correctly, one of GRRM's biggest beefs with LOTR (and one of his main reasons for creating his own realm) was because he hated how Gandalf just kinda came back bc Tolkien missed him or whatever. I can't imagine he was happy with that turn, at all.

You think GRRM is upset that GOT brought back Jon Snow?


He didn't get that far in the books, right? Or am I wrong. Seems like the one thing he was kinda trying not to do
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Tue May 07, 2019 5:48 pm

javy knows my name wrote:
jersey cubs fan wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:
If I'm remembering correctly, one of GRRM's biggest beefs with LOTR (and one of his main reasons for creating his own realm) was because he hated how Gandalf just kinda came back bc Tolkien missed him or whatever. I can't imagine he was happy with that turn, at all.

You think GRRM is upset that GOT brought back Jon Snow?


He didn't get that far in the books, right? Or am I wrong. Seems like the one thing he was kinda trying not to do

I think GRRM advised the future plot enough to indicate he's bringing back Jon. Maybe it will be in a different way, but he's not dead for good.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby javy knows my name » Tue May 07, 2019 5:50 pm

WrigleyField 22 wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:
jersey cubs fan wrote:You think GRRM is upset that GOT brought back Jon Snow?


He didn't get that far in the books, right? Or am I wrong. Seems like the one thing he was kinda trying not to do

I think GRRM advised the future plot enough to indicate he's bringing back Jon. Maybe it will be in a different way, but he's not dead for good.


Yeah, you're right. I guess there's no weight to the planned R + L = J reveal if the [expletive] is dead, huh
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby snoodmonger » Tue May 07, 2019 5:50 pm

WrigleyField 22 wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.

This season would be way better if everyone important died in episode 2 and they spent the next 4 episodes detailing the battle of the three kings between Edmure Tully, Wyman Manderly, and some Martell we've never met.


This got a legit lol from me.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby jersey cubs fan » Tue May 07, 2019 5:51 pm

javy knows my name wrote:
jersey cubs fan wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:
If I'm remembering correctly, one of GRRM's biggest beefs with LOTR (and one of his main reasons for creating his own realm) was because he hated how Gandalf just kinda came back bc Tolkien missed him or whatever. I can't imagine he was happy with that turn, at all.

You think GRRM is upset that GOT brought back Jon Snow?


He didn't get that far in the books, right? Or am I wrong. Seems like the one thing he was kinda trying not to do

If he's not bringing Jon back, he's changed his mind about how he's making the rest of the story. Jon was his secret hero of the books, and he spent a lot of story foreshadowing the plausibility of his return.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Tue May 07, 2019 5:51 pm

javy knows my name wrote:
Banedon wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.


Jon was killed and resurrected. Pretty much the ultimate plot armor.


If I'm remembering correctly, one of GRRM's biggest beefs with LOTR (and one of his main reasons for creating his own realm) was because he hated how Gandalf just kinda came back bc Tolkien missed him or whatever. I can't imagine he was happy with that turn, at all.

Dondarian and Lady Stoneheart are jealous of Jon's treatment in the show, I suppose.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Tue May 07, 2019 5:53 pm

Chocolate Milk wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.

This season would be way better if everyone important died in episode 2 and they spent the next 4 episodes detailing the battle of the three kings between Edmure Tully, Wyman Manderly, and some Martell we've never met.

Lol - I literally saw some post on r/asoiaf that had thousands of upvotes that bemoaning that we didn't know what was going on with Edmure Tully and Robin Arryn.

Supposedly they're on the S8 cast list! Probably standing around a group of other lords in some epilogue type shot showing the new Westeros-world order. Or maybe Edmure actually gets some sort of redemption in some uprising against a distracted Lannister army that's holding him hostage and supplies some small critical reinforcement of bannerman. And maybe Robyn finally learned how to use that bow and arrow!
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby jersey cubs fan » Tue May 07, 2019 5:53 pm

snoodmonger wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:I still laugh about all the plot armor complaints when people have been unrealistically surviving horsefeathers the whole series. I mean Hard Home? Battle of the Bastards where they were being crushed to death by piles of corpses? That battle north of the wall where 6 people fought off the army of the dead? Tormund and the gang surviving the collapse of the wall? It seems crazy to me to have been fine with all that and then all the sudden start adjusting your glasses and being all [nerd voice], "Well, actually..."

I think there were good parts and bad parts to Sunday's episode. I think on the whole, the writing has stayed pretty consistent. This season feels a little like a race to the end, which is a bummer, but there's also the very real possibility that if they had extra eps, it would feel like treading water.

This season would be way better if everyone important died in episode 2 and they spent the next 4 episodes detailing the battle of the three kings between Edmure Tully, Wyman Manderly, and some Martell we've never met.


This got a legit lol from me.

I'm a little annoyed we haven't heard more from the Manderlys. I mean, they just sailed from White Harbor. They were right there. I miss my large adult sons.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby snoodmonger » Tue May 07, 2019 5:57 pm

Chocolate Milk wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:You guys must not read a lot of fantasy, because i was like, "Shadowbaby? Sure, I can dig that."

I've read a totally embarrassing amount of fantasy but that event always seemed out of place to me in this series. The fantastical elements, well the non-dragon ones, were more mystical and somewhat indirect. It just seemed weird that all the sudden she casts a magical spell that has a direct impact on the story.


It's (obviously) all subjective. I just don't see it that far off from Beric Dondarrion being raised from the dead dozens of times, zombie Cat Stark, Dany surviving self-immolation and birthing three dragons from stone eggs, zombie mountain, a horn that controls dragons, etc.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby jersey cubs fan » Tue May 07, 2019 6:04 pm

snoodmonger wrote:
Chocolate Milk wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:You guys must not read a lot of fantasy, because i was like, "Shadowbaby? Sure, I can dig that."

I've read a totally embarrassing amount of fantasy but that event always seemed out of place to me in this series. The fantastical elements, well the non-dragon ones, were more mystical and somewhat indirect. It just seemed weird that all the sudden she casts a magical spell that has a direct impact on the story.


It's (obviously) all subjective. I just don't see it that far off from Beric Dondarrion being raised from the dead dozens of times, zombie Cat Stark, Dany surviving self-immolation and birthing three dragons from stone eggs, zombie mountain, a horn that controls dragons, etc.


most of these things are literally just variations of zombies, where the actual bodies of recently dead people are brought back to life. The horn that controls dragons is still just a concept. The smoke baby born from Stannis's seed (with a one day gestation period?) going off to assassinate Renly is a different beast. It's the only variation of the thing it is. And why did it have to be taken via boat right up to the castle, if it could then travel over land and go find Renly's tent all by himself?

Eh, I actually enjoyed the thing, but it's definitely one of those things where you point out if the TV did it and the book didn't, people would whine about it.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Tim » Tue May 07, 2019 7:34 pm

Anyone that feels GRRM is on another level as a storyteller has a completely different view of the Dorne and Iron Islands stuff than I do. Not to mention all the Cersei chapters.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby OleMissCub » Tue May 07, 2019 9:07 pm

Tim wrote:Anyone that feels GRRM is on another level as a storyteller has a completely different view of the Dorne and Iron Islands stuff than I do. Not to mention all the Cersei chapters.


I dig the Greyjoy stuff. Guess I’m a sucker for that Norse-Viking influence.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby cl smooth » Tue May 07, 2019 10:09 pm

snoodmonger wrote:
Chocolate Milk wrote:
snoodmonger wrote:You guys must not read a lot of fantasy, because i was like, "Shadowbaby? Sure, I can dig that."

I've read a totally embarrassing amount of fantasy but that event always seemed out of place to me in this series. The fantastical elements, well the non-dragon ones, were more mystical and somewhat indirect. It just seemed weird that all the sudden she casts a magical spell that has a direct impact on the story.


It's (obviously) all subjective. I just don't see it that far off from Beric Dondarrion being raised from the dead dozens of times, zombie Cat Stark, Dany surviving self-immolation and birthing three dragons from stone eggs, zombie mountain, a horn that controls dragons, etc.


off-topic: who is your avatar? looks like roddy piper wearing 70s disco clothes.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Wed May 08, 2019 12:36 am

javy knows my name wrote:
jersey cubs fan wrote:
javy knows my name wrote:
If I'm remembering correctly, one of GRRM's biggest beefs with LOTR (and one of his main reasons for creating his own realm) was because he hated how Gandalf just kinda came back bc Tolkien missed him or whatever. I can't imagine he was happy with that turn, at all.

You think GRRM is upset that GOT brought back Jon Snow?


He didn't get that far in the books, right? Or am I wrong. Seems like the one thing he was kinda trying not to do


The last scene of the last published book is Jon dying, but they spent the entire book setting up how he was going to be resurrected. It's 100% a book plot.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby CubinNY » Wed May 08, 2019 4:07 am

OleMissCub wrote:
Tim wrote:Anyone that feels GRRM is on another level as a storyteller has a completely different view of the Dorne and Iron Islands stuff than I do. Not to mention all the Cersei chapters.


I dig the Greyjoy stuff. Guess I’m a sucker for that Norse-Viking influence.

Oh my God. If I read another passage about the succession I would have puked. The Greyjoys (- Euron) and the Baratheons were always going to be foils.

What I was digging from the books is Sam in Old Town. I think his research will be the key to understanding everything related to what is going on with the Maesters (Science) and the different religions that the show didn't touch as well as the White Walkers. I don't think it would have anything to do with the R +J revelation. That was Bran all the way. Also, it was cool there was a secret society of Maesters.
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Re: Game of Thrones

Postby OleMissCub » Wed May 08, 2019 1:12 pm

I think I just had an epiphany and I've no doubt this has been discussed elsewhere, but it's an epiphany to me nonetheless; Sansa is a proxy for Elizabeth I. The ultimate result of the War of the Roses was the Elizabethan Golden Age. At the end of the show, I think Sansa will at the very least be Queen of the North and maybe more. She's very much like Elizabeth, who only had power fall into her lap through a series of siblings dying and who spent her formative years being a marriage bargaining cheap between powerful entities.
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