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Re: Brexit

Postby TruffleShuffle » Sat Jun 25, 2016 12:22 am

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Re: Brexit

Postby wvcbxl » Sun Jun 26, 2016 11:16 am

Lily Allen was one of the more polite reactions to that statement; Donald has since learned the Scots have an impressive arsenal of insulting words.
But this is a family board, so no pics of those tweets. :wink:
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Re: Brexit

Postby vance_the_cubs_fan » Sun Jun 26, 2016 6:47 pm

I figured this was the Scottish reaction to Trump.

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Re: Brexit

Postby Derwood » Sun Jun 26, 2016 9:27 pm

Libertarians are viewing Brexit as some victory for national sovereignty. I can't get behind them on this one. Sorry guys, but national isolationism is not a viable model anymore
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Re: Brexit

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Sun Jun 26, 2016 9:36 pm

Derwood wrote:Libertarians are viewing Brexit as some victory for national sovereignty. I can't get behind them on this one. Sorry guys, but national isolationism is not a viable model anymore

Uh what? Open trade and open borders are pretty big tenants of libertarianism.
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Re: Brexit

Postby Derwood » Mon Jun 27, 2016 12:38 am

WrigleyField 22 wrote:
Derwood wrote:Libertarians are viewing Brexit as some victory for national sovereignty. I can't get behind them on this one. Sorry guys, but national isolationism is not a viable model anymore

Uh what? Open trade and open borders are pretty big tenants of libertarianism.


A fairly large subset of Libertarians are decidedly AGAINST open borders. A lot of them are very unhappy that Johnson is their candidate.
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Re: Brexit

Postby TruffleShuffle » Mon Jun 27, 2016 1:12 am

the Leave campaigners are now hilariously backpedaling, as they realize how horsefeathers that the UK is.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -eu-liars#



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Re: Brexit

Postby TruffleShuffle » Mon Jun 27, 2016 1:15 am

Derwood wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:
Derwood wrote:Libertarians are viewing Brexit as some victory for national sovereignty. I can't get behind them on this one. Sorry guys, but national isolationism is not a viable model anymore

Uh what? Open trade and open borders are pretty big tenants of libertarianism.


A fairly large subset of Libertarians are decidedly AGAINST open borders. A lot of them are very unhappy that Johnson is their candidate.


that's more the american libertarians who are basically just white nationalists but don't feel like they have a home in the republican party. pure libertarianism is strongly in favor of open borders (which is why the liberal democrats in the UK have been so strongly in the Remain camp).
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Re: Brexit

Postby Derwood » Mon Jun 27, 2016 1:27 am

TruffleShuffle wrote:
Derwood wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:Uh what? Open trade and open borders are pretty big tenants of libertarianism.


A fairly large subset of Libertarians are decidedly AGAINST open borders. A lot of them are very unhappy that Johnson is their candidate.


that's more the american libertarians who are basically just white nationalists but don't feel like they have a home in the republican party. pure libertarianism is strongly in favor of open borders (which is why the liberal democrats in the UK have been so strongly in the Remain camp).


American Libertarians are who I was referring to. An odd mix of white nationalists and "taxes are theft" extremists
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Re: Brexit

Postby Tracer Bullet » Mon Jun 27, 2016 1:37 am

So if they decide not to leave, either by just taking forever to negotiate or by having Parliament overrule this stupid vote or something, does Cameron still have to leave? If Boris gets to stay in the EU and become PM, then that's just some [expletive]
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Re: Brexit

Postby TruffleShuffle » Mon Jun 27, 2016 2:38 am

Murton's Revenge wrote:So if they decide not to leave, either by just taking forever to negotiate or by having Parliament overrule this stupid vote or something, does Cameron still have to leave? If Boris gets to stay in the EU and become PM, then that's just some [expletive]


well, cameron is definitely going. he horsefeathers up royally by ever agreeing to a referendum in the first place, but announcing his resignation immediately was clever. the fact that johnson, gove, farage and many other of the Leave politicians were saying that he should stay on indefinitely goes to show how screwed they realize they are. cameron basically said that the messy negotiations with the EU and the economic and political fallout from withdrawing from the EU are out of his hands. rather than get tarnished with all of that and let someone like boris johnson ride in to save the day, he's going to make them deal with the consequences.

a lot of the Leave voters - particularly the xenophobic, racist ones - must be feeling a bit betrayed at this point. many of the Leave politicians have already said they expect free trade and free movement of labor with the EU. farage and other dopes have already begun walking back promises of how much of the supposed "350 million pounds" (which was always a massive lie) will get rolled back into the NHS. agricultural interests and various economic black holes already have their hands out for the British government to provide them with subsidies equal to what they expected to receive as part of the EU. it's incredible how many of the people who benefited heavily from the UK being part of the EU, were so strongly on the side to leave the EU. and now a lot of politicians are saying there's no rush to leave. well, if being in the EU was such a disaster for the UK, why is there no rush?

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/201 ... ing-brexit
http://www.fwi.co.uk/news/dramatic-brex ... ulture.htm

so to answer your question, yes boris johnson could technically become PM while not withdrawing from the EU. but he and the other main contenders are going to have to stake out positions on how the withdrawal will happen. being as he was a Leave supporter in the first place, he wouldn't last long as PM if he reneged on the referendum result. basically any Tory replacement would have to explain their pathway to leaving the EU.

probably the only way out of the mess is to dissolve parliament and hold a new election. if the tories didn't win a majority at the election, and there were big gains by the pro-Remain parties or politicians, then that could be used as evidence to ignore the referendum result.
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Re: Brexit

Postby CubinNY » Mon Jun 27, 2016 5:30 pm

I think they will find a way to do another referendum.

Thank goodness our founding fathers saw the pitfalls of direct democracy.
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Re: Brexit

Postby Banedon » Mon Jun 27, 2016 5:54 pm

CubinNY wrote:I think they will find a way to do another referendum.

Thank goodness our founding fathers saw the pitfalls of direct democracy.


This isn't direct democracy though. This was a referendum. My understanding is that by itself it doesn't really do anything...the withdrawal process still has to happen through Parliament.
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Re: Brexit

Postby CubinNY » Mon Jun 27, 2016 6:29 pm

Banedon wrote:
CubinNY wrote:I think they will find a way to do another referendum.

Thank goodness our founding fathers saw the pitfalls of direct democracy.


This isn't direct democracy though. This was a referendum. My understanding is that by itself it doesn't really do anything...the withdrawal process still has to happen through Parliament.

I was talking metaphorically, however, it's as good as direct democracy if they follow the results and pull out.

Speaking big picture here. It's about time that the elected leaders from both side of the aisle, both here and abroad, realize that the last 35 years of unchecked trickle down economics disguised as public policy has lead to what we are seeing now. It is only going to get worse unless they change their course, globalization be damned (i.e., you cannot blame all of the issues on globalization forever).
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Re: Brexit

Postby Sammy Sofa » Mon Jun 27, 2016 6:40 pm

Aisle.
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Re: Brexit

Postby CubinNY » Mon Jun 27, 2016 6:41 pm

Sammy Sofa wrote:Aisle.

thanxs
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Re: Brexit

Postby jersey cubs fan » Mon Jun 27, 2016 7:05 pm

Sammy Sofa wrote:Aisle.

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Re: Brexit

Postby LeftCoastCubFan » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:09 am

CubinNY wrote:Speaking big picture here. It's about time that the elected leaders from both side of the aisle, both here and abroad, realize that the last 35 years of unchecked trickle down economics disguised as public policy has lead to what we are seeing now. It is only going to get worse unless they change their course, globalization be damned (i.e., you cannot blame all of the issues on globalization forever).

It's been happening for over 45 years. You cannot blame all of the issues on trickle down economics. It's more complex than that.
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Re: Brexit

Postby CubinNY » Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:25 pm

LeftCoastCubFan wrote:
CubinNY wrote:Speaking big picture here. It's about time that the elected leaders from both side of the aisle, both here and abroad, realize that the last 35 years of unchecked trickle down economics disguised as public policy has lead to what we are seeing now. It is only going to get worse unless they change their course, globalization be damned (i.e., you cannot blame all of the issues on globalization forever).

It's been happening for over 45 years. You cannot blame all of the issues on trickle down economics. It's more complex than that.

Not really.

People have legitimate gripes about trade treaties that supercede local, state, and national law in favor of a multinational corporation. The have legitimate gripes about stagnant wages, and lack of opportunity. It's understandable but unfortunate that they turn to the right when these things happen. When the establishment right cannot or will not help, you end up with a Brexit leave vote or a Donald Trump.

There are systemic problems that are not being addressed.
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Re: Brexit

Postby Tim » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:16 pm

CubinNY wrote:
LeftCoastCubFan wrote:
CubinNY wrote:Speaking big picture here. It's about time that the elected leaders from both side of the aisle, both here and abroad, realize that the last 35 years of unchecked trickle down economics disguised as public policy has lead to what we are seeing now. It is only going to get worse unless they change their course, globalization be damned (i.e., you cannot blame all of the issues on globalization forever).

It's been happening for over 45 years. You cannot blame all of the issues on trickle down economics. It's more complex than that.

Not really.

People have legitimate gripes about trade treaties that supercede local, state, and national law in favor of a multinational corporation. The have legitimate gripes about stagnant wages, and lack of opportunity. It's understandable but unfortunate that they turn to the right when these things happen. When the establishment right cannot or will not help, you end up with a Brexit leave vote or a Donald Trump.

There are systemic problems that are not being addressed.

I believe what he is trying to imply is that only very simple problems have a single root cause. Blaming everything on "trickle down economics" ignores a plethora of other causes for a convenient oversimplification of the issues.
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Re: Brexit

Postby CubinNY » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:24 pm

Tim wrote:
CubinNY wrote:
LeftCoastCubFan wrote:It's been happening for over 45 years. You cannot blame all of the issues on trickle down economics. It's more complex than that.

Not really.

People have legitimate gripes about trade treaties that supercede local, state, and national law in favor of a multinational corporation. The have legitimate gripes about stagnant wages, and lack of opportunity. It's understandable but unfortunate that they turn to the right when these things happen. When the establishment right cannot or will not help, you end up with a Brexit leave vote or a Donald Trump.

There are systemic problems that are not being addressed.

I believe what he is trying to imply is that only very simple problems have a single root cause. Blaming everything on "trickle down economics" ignores a plethora of other causes for a convenient oversimplification of the issues.

Every other problem stems from that one philosophy, yes. The solutions are not easy or painless for everyone.
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Re: Brexit

Postby Tim » Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:42 pm

CubinNY wrote:
Tim wrote:
CubinNY wrote:Not really.

People have legitimate gripes about trade treaties that supercede local, state, and national law in favor of a multinational corporation. The have legitimate gripes about stagnant wages, and lack of opportunity. It's understandable but unfortunate that they turn to the right when these things happen. When the establishment right cannot or will not help, you end up with a Brexit leave vote or a Donald Trump.

There are systemic problems that are not being addressed.

I believe what he is trying to imply is that only very simple problems have a single root cause. Blaming everything on "trickle down economics" ignores a plethora of other causes for a convenient oversimplification of the issues.

Every other problem stems from that one philosophy, yes. The solutions are not easy or painless for everyone.

Just as an easy example, the aging population does not stem from that one philosophy.
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Re: Brexit

Postby TruffleShuffle » Thu Jun 30, 2016 1:54 pm

that idiot with the stupid hair isn't contesting for prime minister.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/ ... leadership

This must be the worst gamble in political history,” said Tim Bale, professor of politics at Queen Mary University of London. “He’s managed to burn down Britain, burn the prime minister and set himself on fire. In the end, he’s nothing if not a realist, and he’s realized that he’s blown it. It seems incredible someone would risk so much personally and the future of the country for a massive gamble that hasn’t paid off.”


:lol:
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Re: Brexit

Postby jersey cubs fan » Thu Jun 30, 2016 1:59 pm

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Re: Brexit

Postby jersey cubs fan » Mon Dec 10, 2018 9:46 pm



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