Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

User avatar
minnesotacubsfan
Hall of Fame
Posts: 20073
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2003 2:27 pm
Location: I CANT BREATHE
x 3342
x 1230

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby minnesotacubsfan » Wed Feb 17, 2021 4:21 pm

rawaction wrote:Sounds like the Bears are all but out of the Wentz "sweepstakes" now. They won't trade for him unless they know he wants to be in Chicago. No word on whether he would want to be in Chicago, but definitely prefers Indianapolis. Definitely seems like the Bears had the best offer though.

I probably like Wentz more than most Bears fans, so I had talked myself into that this was going to happen. NGL, I'm slightly disappointed, because I don't know where else the Bears can realistically go to find competent QB play. Not that Wentz was guaranteed competence, but not many of the other options seem very realistic at this point. Carr doesn't seem like he's being traded. If Watson gets traded, it won't be to Chicago. Sounds like Dak is getting tagged again. Doesn't seem like they're interested in draft prospects.


yup. "we're going to be big players in the qb market" until they realize they are playing from a little player position.

Foles and Mac Jones (?) here we come
0 x
Image

Bertz
All-Star
Posts: 2966
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2017 2:59 pm
x 1191
x 1752

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby Bertz » Wed Feb 17, 2021 6:44 pm

rawaction wrote:Sounds like the Bears are all but out of the Wentz "sweepstakes" now. They won't trade for him unless they know he wants to be in Chicago. No word on whether he would want to be in Chicago, but definitely prefers Indianapolis. Definitely seems like the Bears had the best offer though.

I probably like Wentz more than most Bears fans, so I had talked myself into that this was going to happen. NGL, I'm slightly disappointed, because I don't know where else the Bears can realistically go to find competent QB play. Not that Wentz was guaranteed competence, but not many of the other options seem very realistic at this point. Carr doesn't seem like he's being traded. If Watson gets traded, it won't be to Chicago. Sounds like Dak is getting tagged again. Doesn't seem like they're interested in draft prospects.


Works for me. Wentz hasn't actually gone anywhere either, so there's still opportunity to revisit when he and/or the Eagles become more reasonable.

I tend to think at least one, probably both of Bridgewater/Garappolo can be had too. They're a little lower upside than Wentz, but that much safer. And I'd say the expected production of all three guys is similar (somewhere in the teens if you were ranking every QB ordinally).

For me, the play is to get whichever of those three guys costs the least in draft picks and take a day 2 QB in the draft. In FA, do what you can, but don't add any long term $ except maybe a Robinson extension.
1 x

User avatar
rawaction
Hall of Fame
Posts: 35538
Joined: Thu May 29, 2003 11:04 pm
x 886
x 1052

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby rawaction » Wed Feb 17, 2021 8:43 pm

Bertz wrote:
rawaction wrote:Sounds like the Bears are all but out of the Wentz "sweepstakes" now. They won't trade for him unless they know he wants to be in Chicago. No word on whether he would want to be in Chicago, but definitely prefers Indianapolis. Definitely seems like the Bears had the best offer though.

I probably like Wentz more than most Bears fans, so I had talked myself into that this was going to happen. NGL, I'm slightly disappointed, because I don't know where else the Bears can realistically go to find competent QB play. Not that Wentz was guaranteed competence, but not many of the other options seem very realistic at this point. Carr doesn't seem like he's being traded. If Watson gets traded, it won't be to Chicago. Sounds like Dak is getting tagged again. Doesn't seem like they're interested in draft prospects.


Works for me. Wentz hasn't actually gone anywhere either, so there's still opportunity to revisit when he and/or the Eagles become more reasonable.

I tend to think at least one, probably both of Bridgewater/Garappolo can be had too. They're a little lower upside than Wentz, but that much safer. And I'd say the expected production of all three guys is similar (somewhere in the teens if you were ranking every QB ordinally).

For me, the play is to get whichever of those three guys costs the least in draft picks and take a day 2 QB in the draft. In FA, do what you can, but don't add any long term $ except maybe a Robinson extension.


Yeah, other than Watson and Prescott, none of the options are long-term, franchise changing QBs. Wentz, Bridgewater, Jimmy G, MInshew, etc. are all guys that can get the team by for a couple years (at best) while you hopefully draft and develop an actual real long-term QB. If they can get any of the latter guys, I'd hope it's for cheap enough that the Bears can potentially add an early QB in this draft, even if they have to trade up (Lance). Derek Carr is an interesting one, because he's probably somewhere in the middle. He's better than the latter group, but would be treated like he's one of the elites, requiring a lot of trade capital and likely a big contract extension.
0 x

CaliforniaRaisin
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 91905
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 2:20 pm
Location: Pasadena, CA
x 839
x 3616

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby CaliforniaRaisin » Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:46 pm



That’s not bad.
0 x
Image

Bertz
All-Star
Posts: 2966
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2017 2:59 pm
x 1191
x 1752

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby Bertz » Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:48 pm

Yeah, no appetite on my end to pay that price

Image
1 x

User avatar
WrigleyField 22
Superstar
Posts: 15523
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:48 pm
Location: hnderstabxcwhsg
x 3626
x 2018

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 4:56 pm

Bertz wrote:Yeah, no appetite on my end to pay that price

Image

Its about what I would have expected if you asked me a month or so ago what a Wentz value would be. Probably best for the Bears not to be the one to do it, but fairly reasonable.
0 x
Image

Bertz
All-Star
Posts: 2966
Joined: Thu Oct 19, 2017 2:59 pm
x 1191
x 1752

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby Bertz » Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:03 pm

0 x

User avatar
Hairyducked Idiot
Kyle in disguise
Posts: 36111
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 2:42 pm
Location: GRIP IT AND RIP IT
x 2816
x 3710

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:20 pm

Yeah, I don't have a problem with the value. I just don't want to trade picks for another retread QB.
0 x

champaignchris
Starter
Posts: 983
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2008 4:40 pm
x 10
x 218

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby champaignchris » Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:46 pm

I wouldn’t have been horribly mad had the Bears paid that to get Wentz, but I wouldn’t have been really excited either.

Maybe Wentz goes back to being the guy he was in 2017 and proves me wrong, but I think it’s likely that other guys available for cheaper can bring the same performance to the Bears.
0 x

User avatar
jersey cubs fan
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 62874
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:38 pm
Location: Hoboken squat cobbler
x 3572
x 12872

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Thu Feb 18, 2021 5:53 pm

That price is nothing. If you give up your first it’s only if he proves to be your guy.
0 x
longhotsummer wrote:I realize now, any opposing viewpoint, will not be tolerated.

abmillis
All-Star
Posts: 1351
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:46 pm
Location: Bridgeport, IL
x 545
x 147

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby abmillis » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:25 pm

I kinda want them to make the worst (talent-wise) choice possible (Fitzpatrick?) and accidentally tank, getting Nagy and Pace fired.

2022 QBs worth checking out from a quick look at 2022 mocks: Sam Howell (UNC), Tyler Shough (formerly of Oregon, transferring), Kedon Slovis (USC), Spencer Rattler (OU), and JT Daniels (UGA)...
1 x

User avatar
WrigleyField 22
Superstar
Posts: 15523
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:48 pm
Location: hnderstabxcwhsg
x 3626
x 2018

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:33 pm

jersey cubs fan wrote:That price is nothing. If you give up your first it’s only if he proves to be your guy.

I suppose only if they want to be really ruthless with him. Like if they win despite his play, you ideally want to bench him before he hits the 70% mark and save the first.

Obviously if they're just flat out sucky its easy to bench him anyways and save yourself the risk of losing a high first.

Like would they still try to bring Brisset back as a veteran contingency to Wentz? He's a guy I wouldn't mind if the Bears up having to just get the best vet backup they can to come compete with Foles.
0 x
Image

User avatar
WrigleyField 22
Superstar
Posts: 15523
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:48 pm
Location: hnderstabxcwhsg
x 3626
x 2018

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:35 pm

abmillis wrote:I kinda want them to make the worst (talent-wise) choice possible (Fitzpatrick?) and accidentally tank, getting Nagy and Pace fired.

2022 QBs worth checking out from a quick look at 2022 mocks: Sam Howell (UNC), Tyler Shough (formerly of Oregon, transferring), Kedon Slovis (USC), Spencer Rattler (OU), and JT Daniels (UGA)...

Fitzpatrick is the worst talent choice available?

It seems like they already have a good tank candidate in Foles, though starting Coward again would really put the finishing touch on a tank job.
1 x
Image

User avatar
Outshined_One
Blam.
Posts: 32279
Joined: Mon Oct 20, 2003 7:38 am
Location: Chicago, IL
x 1
x 111

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby Outshined_One » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:40 pm

I think the Colts, Eagles, and Wentz did pretty well with this deal. The Eagles got multiple picks, including a first rounder if Wentz succeeds. The Colts get an established veteran QB with upside at a fair price. Wentz is going into a fairly stable situation in Indy with decent odds of making the playoffs next season given the state of the AFC South. Something tells me this trade would have been an outright disaster for the Bears if they were in the Colts' shoes.

I'm kind of looking forward to seeing the dead look in Ryan Pace's eyes when he spends an inordinate amount of time explaining why he believes Gardner Minshew is the Bears' QB of the future.
2 x

abmillis
All-Star
Posts: 1351
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 10:46 pm
Location: Bridgeport, IL
x 545
x 147

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby abmillis » Thu Feb 18, 2021 6:56 pm

WrigleyField 22 wrote:
abmillis wrote:I kinda want them to make the worst (talent-wise) choice possible (Fitzpatrick?) and accidentally tank, getting Nagy and Pace fired.

2022 QBs worth checking out from a quick look at 2022 mocks: Sam Howell (UNC), Tyler Shough (formerly of Oregon, transferring), Kedon Slovis (USC), Spencer Rattler (OU), and JT Daniels (UGA)...

Fitzpatrick is the worst talent choice available?

It seems like they already have a good tank candidate in Foles, though starting Coward again would really put the finishing touch on a tank job.


I meant of guys who wouldn't be a joke of a starter. Like, Andy Dalton is out there, but nobody could really see him as a guy who pushes this Bears team to the playoffs. You could at least sell the argument of Fitzpatrick as a guy who makes plays and has experience. I don't think they could even possibly sell Foles as the starter going into '21 without being eviscerated in the media.
0 x

User avatar
WrigleyField 22
Superstar
Posts: 15523
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:48 pm
Location: hnderstabxcwhsg
x 3626
x 2018

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:24 pm

abmillis wrote:
WrigleyField 22 wrote:
abmillis wrote:I kinda want them to make the worst (talent-wise) choice possible (Fitzpatrick?) and accidentally tank, getting Nagy and Pace fired.

2022 QBs worth checking out from a quick look at 2022 mocks: Sam Howell (UNC), Tyler Shough (formerly of Oregon, transferring), Kedon Slovis (USC), Spencer Rattler (OU), and JT Daniels (UGA)...

Fitzpatrick is the worst talent choice available?

It seems like they already have a good tank candidate in Foles, though starting Coward again would really put the finishing touch on a tank job.


I meant of guys who wouldn't be a joke of a starter. Like, Andy Dalton is out there, but nobody could really see him as a guy who pushes this Bears team to the playoffs. You could at least sell the argument of Fitzpatrick as a guy who makes plays and has experience. I don't think they could even possibly sell Foles as the starter going into '21 without being eviscerated in the media.

Maybe you can get by with Foles without being eviscerated if you draft a guy. If it's like Foles and Bray, omg they would rightfully be destroyed.

Since they seem intent on competing I'd say go vet FA like Fitz and draft a guy. Just start throwing options out there hoping one catches lighting in a bottle.
0 x
Image

User avatar
WrigleyField 22
Superstar
Posts: 15523
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:48 pm
Location: hnderstabxcwhsg
x 3626
x 2018

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby WrigleyField 22 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:28 pm

Unless Carr materializes its probably:

Ryan Fitzpatrick
Jacoby Brisset
Tyrod Taylor
Marcus Mariota(?)
Jameis Winston
Joe Flacco

Any others?

Obviously discounting any of the other big-ish names via trade. These are all FA or could be cut.
0 x
Image

TomtheBombadil
5-Time All-Star
Posts: 9586
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 8:35 pm
x 954
x 977

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby TomtheBombadil » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:32 pm

We are all going to laugh and laugh together when the Bears end up with Sam Darnold

Edit...Ha:



0 x
Spoiler: show
Image


"We struck down evil with the mighty sword of teamwork and the hammer of not-bickering." - The Shoveler

User avatar
gflore34
5-Time All-Star
Posts: 5010
Joined: Wed Sep 01, 2004 5:32 pm
Location: Lansing, MI.
x 93
x 141

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby gflore34 » Thu Feb 18, 2021 7:43 pm

TomtheBombadil wrote:We are all going to laugh and laugh together when the Bears end up with Sam Darnold

Edit...Ha:





Sam Darnold? Don't know much about him, is he capable of making all the reads? Or, does Nagy have to cut the field in half, limit the playbook etc. for him as well? I'd like to see what happens when Nagy no longer has the excuse of a QB with mental limitations.
0 x

User avatar
Hairyducked Idiot
Kyle in disguise
Posts: 36111
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 2:42 pm
Location: GRIP IT AND RIP IT
x 2816
x 3710

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Thu Feb 18, 2021 8:02 pm

I love that our entire offseason is consumed by finding a bridge QB when that was literally the point of Nick Foles.
5 x

User avatar
Proven Veteran
All-Star
Posts: 2396
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2004 6:47 pm
Location: Oakland, CA
x 1684
x 294

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby Proven Veteran » Thu Feb 18, 2021 9:11 pm

0 x

TomtheBombadil
5-Time All-Star
Posts: 9586
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 8:35 pm
x 954
x 977

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby TomtheBombadil » Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:02 pm

gflore34 wrote:Sam Darnold? Don't know much about him, is he capable of making all the reads? Or, does Nagy have to cut the field in half, limit the playbook etc. for him as well? I'd like to see what happens when Nagy no longer has the excuse of a QB with mental limitations.


Darnold's terrible but his draft position, youth, and the Gase excuse will probably have someone hoping he's Tannehill. Catch with that is Tannehill wasn't a half bad QB in Miami while Darnold's been terrible

OTOH maybe in this age of Josh Allen, there's room for optimism?

To answer your question: I think he'd struggle with whatever - half, whole, part, a smidge, etc - unless he doesn't
0 x
Spoiler: show
Image


"We struck down evil with the mighty sword of teamwork and the hammer of not-bickering." - The Shoveler

champaignchris
Starter
Posts: 983
Joined: Tue Feb 05, 2008 4:40 pm
x 10
x 218

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby champaignchris » Thu Feb 18, 2021 11:57 pm

The one thing Darnold has going for him is that he’s still young enough to be called a legitimate prospect. He’s three years younger than Trubisky and only a year older than Mac Jones, the qb most likely to be available when the Bears pick in the first round.

Assuming the Jets release Darnold, he’s likely be a smaller cap hit than a 1st round qb and the Bears would still be able to make a first round pick. So, the question is whether the Bears see anything on tape they think is salvageable.

I don’t think grabbing Darnold and a day 2 qb while shoring up the OL and receiving core, and then seeing if any of Darnold, Foles, or Day2QB look like they can be “the guy” is the worst move the Bears can make. It would certainly be a better idea than overdrafting a guy like Jones or sending more picks on bringing in another mediocre veteran.
0 x

User avatar
jersey cubs fan
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 62874
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:38 pm
Location: Hoboken squat cobbler
x 3572
x 12872

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby jersey cubs fan » Fri Feb 19, 2021 12:03 am

champaignchris wrote:
Assuming the Jets release Darnold, he’s likely be a smaller cap hit than a 1st round qb and the Bears would still be able to make a first round pick. So, the question is whether the Bears see anything on tape they think is salvageable.

Why would they release him? He’s cheap and young, they’ll trade him for something. And fwiw, a rando ny sports talk host and thinks they can get a late 1st for him.

That’s insane but it’s reasonable to assume they can get a pick for him.
0 x
longhotsummer wrote:I realize now, any opposing viewpoint, will not be tolerated.

User avatar
minnesotacubsfan
Hall of Fame
Posts: 20073
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2003 2:27 pm
Location: I CANT BREATHE
x 3342
x 1230

Re: Are we getting Black Monday II? Bears offseason thread

Postby minnesotacubsfan » Fri Feb 19, 2021 12:05 am

jersey cubs fan wrote:
champaignchris wrote:
Assuming the Jets release Darnold, he’s likely be a smaller cap hit than a 1st round qb and the Bears would still be able to make a first round pick. So, the question is whether the Bears see anything on tape they think is salvageable.

Why would they release him? He’s cheap and young, they’ll trade him for something. And fwiw, a rando ny sports talk host and thinks they can get a late 1st for him.

That’s insane but it’s reasonable to assume they can get a pick for him.


its also reasonable to assume that since its the Jets were speaking of, any stupidity would be possible
0 x
Image


Return to “Other Sports”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests