The Bryce is Right, Bitch

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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Andy » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:44 pm

David wrote:i was gonna say easily machado (and prob still do)

but did anyone notice what a pooey (by his standards) 2017 he had?

I had him in fantasy. I noticed.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby toonsterwu » Fri Dec 15, 2017 9:44 pm

I wouldn't read too much into the rhetoric about letting things play out until after 2018. If I recall correctly, there was similar talk about letting Strasburg hit FA before they revisited. The Nationals front office, though, to put it bluntly ... they aren't the Orioles front office.

I'd love Harper on the Cubs, and it sure feels like it's going to be Cubs or Nationals. My gut hunch would still lean Nationals, but a lot is probably dependent on how Harper gets along with Dave Martinez. By most accounts, Bryce likes the DC area quite a bit At the end of the day, though, I think the main things that lead me to think he's going to be with the Nationals is

a) His talk about wanting to be a one-team guy (granted, money and winning talks in the end), but the Nationals are well setup for the future, as their system is solid right now.

and

b) the fact that Boras and Ted Lerner have a ridiculously close relationship. IIRC the articles post-Strasburg, they consistently meet up to discuss things, somewhat bypassing Mike Rizzo, although Rizzo still makes the decisions. Boras convinced Lerner to bend on 7 years for Strasburg (which, IIRC, was what the FO had told Lerner what it would probably take as well).
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby CubinNY » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:30 pm

toonsterwu wrote:I wouldn't read too much into the rhetoric about letting things play out until after 2018. If I recall correctly, there was similar talk about letting Strasburg hit FA before they revisited. The Nationals front office, though, to put it bluntly ... they aren't the Orioles front office.

I'd love Harper on the Cubs, and it sure feels like it's going to be Cubs or Nationals. My gut hunch would still lean Nationals, but a lot is probably dependent on how Harper gets along with Dave Martinez. By most accounts, Bryce likes the DC area quite a bit At the end of the day, though, I think the main things that lead me to think he's going to be with the Nationals is

a) His talk about wanting to be a one-team guy (granted, money and winning talks in the end), but the Nationals are well setup for the future, as their system is solid right now.

and

b) the fact that Boras and Ted Lerner have a ridiculously close relationship. IIRC the articles post-Strasburg, they consistently meet up to discuss things, somewhat bypassing Mike Rizzo, although Rizzo still makes the decisions. Boras convinced Lerner to bend on 7 years for Strasburg (which, IIRC, was what the FO had told Lerner what it would probably take as well).

It depends on if he wants to win. The Nats don’t have the resources to build a winning team a give him 1/3 or 1/4 of the entire money spent on the team.
Last edited by CubinNY on Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby nunley15 » Fri Dec 15, 2017 11:50 pm

Have any of these super pay trades ever worked? ARod/Stanton/ been benificial, in the long run to the health of a team? We have the best defense right fielder in the NL who is working toward being a better hitter. I don't want that Boras super contract on our heads for 5 years when Rizzo and Bryant will be up for FA soon. Where does this decision make any sense?


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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Gilby » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:09 am

CubinNY wrote:
toonsterwu wrote:I wouldn't read too much into the rhetoric about letting things play out until after 2018. If I recall correctly, there was similar talk about letting Strasburg hit FA before they revisited. The Nationals front office, though, to put it bluntly ... they aren't the Orioles front office.

I'd love Harper on the Cubs, and it sure feels like it's going to be Cubs or Nationals. My gut hunch would still lean Nationals, but a lot is probably dependent on how Harper gets along with Dave Martinez. By most accounts, Bryce likes the DC area quite a bit At the end of the day, though, I think the main things that lead me to think he's going to be with the Nationals is

a) His talk about wanting to be a one-team guy (granted, money and winning talks in the end), but the Nationals are well setup for the future, as their system is solid right now.

and

b) the fact that Boras and Ted Lerner have a ridiculously close relationship. IIRC the articles post-Strasburg, they consistently meet up to discuss things, somewhat bypassing Mike Rizzo, although Rizzo still makes the decisions. Boras convinced Lerner to bend on 7 years for Strasburg (which, IIRC, was what the FO had told Lerner what it would probably take as well).

It depends on if he wants to win. The Nats don’t have the resources to build a winning team a give him 1/3 or 1/2 of the entire money spent on the team.


Oh come on. Their future is as bright as pretty much anyone's.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby TomtheBombadil » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:11 am

nunley15 wrote:Have any of these super pay trades ever worked? ARod/Stanton/ been benificial, in the long run to the health of a team? We have the best defense right fielder in the NL who is working toward being a better hitter. I don't want that Boras super contract on our heads for 5 years when Rizzo and Bryant will be up for FA soon. Where does this decision make any sense?


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ARod was absolutely worth his deal/s. Stanton’s doing fine so far too.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby David » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:19 am

TomtheBombadil wrote:
nunley15 wrote:Have any of these super pay trades ever worked? ARod/Stanton/ been benificial, in the long run to the health of a team? We have the best defense right fielder in the NL who is working toward being a better hitter. I don't want that Boras super contract on our heads for 5 years when Rizzo and Bryant will be up for FA soon. Where does this decision make any sense?


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ARod was absolutely worth his deal/s. Stanton’s doing fine so far too.


Don't forget Beltran, which was pretty damn huge at the time.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby David » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:21 am

nunley15 wrote:Have any of these super pay trades ever worked? ARod/Stanton/ been benificial, in the long run to the health of a team? We have the best defense right fielder in the NL who is working toward being a better hitter. I don't want that Boras super contract on our heads for 5 years when Rizzo and Bryant will be up for FA soon. Where does this decision make any sense?


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the 2nd best player in the game at age 26 is absolutely the type of guy you invest heavily in
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby David » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:23 am

and i'm not saying this should or will happen, but another thing i don't understand is the fear that if we sign bryce harper, we might not be able to extend someone down the road...well, uh, ok, but we have bryce harper
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:40 am

David wrote:and i'm not saying this should or will happen, but another thing i don't understand is the fear that if we sign bryce harper, we might not be able to extend someone down the road...well, uh, ok, but we have bryce harper


This really gets so undersold. "What if we can't keep all the position players through arbitration?" "You mean what if we have to trade Baez or Schwarber so we can have Bryce Harper for the back half of his 20's, plus the return from that trade?"
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:47 am

Yeah god forbid our lineup needs to be reduced to Harper, Bryant, Willson (through their late 20s ands early 30s) along with whatever we get for trading off Russell/Baez/Happ/Schwarber and a bunch of Tommy LaStellas and Jon Jays types in FA. We might only score 850 runs.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby JennieGarthAlgar » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:06 am

Bryant+Harper+Contreras > Stanton+Judge+Sanchez
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Gilby » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:09 am

Isn't the real fear "What if we can't re-sign Kris Bryant?" Like right now I doubt anyone is too concerned about losing Russell or Schwarber if we get Harper. And yeah, the possibility of not extending Bryant is probably worth it considering we'd have the two best players in the NL together for three years, but it's worth bringing up.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:12 am

Gilby wrote:Isn't the real fear "What if we can't re-sign Kris Bryant?" Like right now I doubt anyone is too concerned about losing Russell or Schwarber if we get Harper. And yeah, it's probably worth it considering we'd have the two best players in the NL together for three years, but it's worth bringing up.

You don’t not sign Harper because “you maybe can’t re-sign Bryant” 3-4 years later.


Spoiler alert, we’ll be able to sign Harper and keep Bryant if we want. If he leaves it won’t be because we can’t afford him.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby David » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:14 am

Gilby wrote:Isn't the real fear "What if we can't re-sign Kris Bryant?" Like right now I doubt anyone is too concerned about losing Russell or Schwarber if we get Harper. And yeah, the possibility of not extending Bryant is probably worth it considering we'd have the two best players in the NL together for three years, but it's worth bringing up.

Harper is younger and at least as good... But if they want to (and can - assuming he wants to stay) keep Bryant, it's those lesser guys who will go.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Transmogrified Tiger » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:16 am

Gilby wrote:Isn't the real fear "What if we can't re-sign Kris Bryant?" Like right now I doubt anyone is too concerned about losing Russell or Schwarber if we get Harper. And yeah, the possibility of not extending Bryant is probably worth it considering we'd have the two best players in the NL together for three years, but it's worth bringing up.


The only person under contract beyond Bryant's arbitration years is Heyward. There's definitely some risk with all of Bryant, Baez, Russell, and Schwarber hitting FA the same year, but that's so far away as to not be a concern impacting today's decisions, because they may extend, trade, or not care about the non-Bryant guys by that point. Also, predicting the composition of the rest of the roster in 4 years is impossible.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:16 am

nunley15 wrote:Have any of these super pay trades ever worked? ARod/Stanton/ been benificial, in the long run to the health of a team? We have the best defense right fielder in the NL who is working toward being a better hitter. I don't want that Boras super contract on our heads for 5 years when Rizzo and Bryant will be up for FA soon. Where does this decision make any sense?


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The first A-Rod megadeal, with Texas, was good value for what he produced.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Gilby » Sat Dec 16, 2017 1:21 am

Cubswin11 wrote:
Gilby wrote:Isn't the real fear "What if we can't re-sign Kris Bryant?" Like right now I doubt anyone is too concerned about losing Russell or Schwarber if we get Harper. And yeah, it's probably worth it considering we'd have the two best players in the NL together for three years, but it's worth bringing up.

You don’t not sign Harper because “you maybe can’t re-sign Bryant” 3-4 years later.


Spoiler alert, we’ll be able to sign Harper and keep Bryant if we want. If he leaves it won’t be because we can’t afford him.


The first part, yeah, I'm pretty sure I agree with.

The second part I don't find realistic.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Thrilho » Sat Dec 16, 2017 2:43 am

Gilby wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:
Gilby wrote:Isn't the real fear "What if we can't re-sign Kris Bryant?" Like right now I doubt anyone is too concerned about losing Russell or Schwarber if we get Harper. And yeah, it's probably worth it considering we'd have the two best players in the NL together for three years, but it's worth bringing up.

You don’t not sign Harper because “you maybe can’t re-sign Bryant” 3-4 years later.


Spoiler alert, we’ll be able to sign Harper and keep Bryant if we want. If he leaves it won’t be because we can’t afford him.


The first part, yeah, I'm pretty sure I agree with.

The second part I don't find realistic.

The Cards were a contender for lots of years because they had Pujols or McGwire. Having one MVP type in the middle of your order can put you in contention without a ton around him. With a KB, Harper, Contreras middle of the order you've got a lot of flexibility with the rest of the team. They haven't needed to do it at the skill positions, but they could grab Neil Walker/Jon Jay/La Stella types at a few positions and still be real good.

They've been real good at getting value pitching and I don't know why anyone would expect that to stop. At some point they may need to have two $25M pitchers on the roster, but they've been making the playoffs and won a WS without it so far. If the choice ever comes down to scrimping on pitching to have another young MVP hitter in the lineup I think you take the elite hitters and trade some other assets for pitching.

Then, correct me if I'm wrong, but sending money to another team doesn't affect the salary cap. So if the worry is the cap, they can always launch Heyward and pay a bunch to do it. And with the new revenue streams I think that's the type of thing the Ricketts wouldn't bat an eye at. Like CubinNY said, the Cubs are going to own a city block, a hotel, have a new TV deal, and all kinds of revenue streams. And they've already destroyed the concept of "people won't buy Cubs stuff anymore when they're no longer the loveable losers." If they have to eat some Heyward money to Harper into the long term plan I'm pretty sure that the increased chances of being a contender/retaining KB would make financial sense even forgetting about wanting the good baseball team.

They've got tons young guys available to trade for other, cheaper young guys when the time comes. Whether that's for pitching or hitting. But it's a little like Monopoly. When you land on Boardwalk, you buy it and worry about the rest later.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby UMFan83 » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:41 pm



They gotta slow down this bromance otherwise Rizzo is going to veto signing Bryce next year.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby JennieGarthAlgar » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:53 pm

UMFan83 wrote:https://twitter.com/byjordanowen/status/944244542458466304

They gotta slow down this bromance otherwise Rizzo is going to veto signing Bryce next year.


I am sure once Rizzo comes back from his honeymoon he will slide right back in to their weird little multi family thing they are building and that I am jealous of.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Bryant's Disco Ball » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:56 pm

I'm so happy that Harper hits free agency before Bryant does.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Derwood » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:57 pm

Bryper or Harpant don't have the same ring as Bryzzo.

But I'll let it go this time
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Cubswin11 » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:58 pm

JennieGarthAlgar wrote:
UMFan83 wrote:https://twitter.com/byjordanowen/status/944244542458466304

They gotta slow down this bromance otherwise Rizzo is going to veto signing Bryce next year.


I am sure once Rizzo comes back from his honeymoon he will slide right back in to their weird little multi family thing they are building and that I am jealous of.

Rizzo is too busy being a normal dude than to get caught up in the weirdo Mormon stuff those guys are in to. He’s letting Kris do the heavy lifting on this one.
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Re: THE Bryce Harper in 2018 Thread

Postby Sammy Sofa » Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:02 pm

JennieGarthAlgar wrote:
UMFan83 wrote:https://twitter.com/byjordanowen/status/944244542458466304

They gotta slow down this bromance otherwise Rizzo is going to veto signing Bryce next year.


I am sure once Rizzo comes back from his honeymoon he will slide right back in to their weird little multi family thing they are building and that I am jealous of.


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