Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

User avatar
weis21
5-Time All-Star
Posts: 8864
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 6:45 am
Location: ECU
x 5562
x 1108

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby weis21 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:26 pm

jersey cubs fan wrote:
Derwood wrote:Is Chatwood a guy who might be groomed as a closer later in his career?

without being able to strike anybody out and with a lot of walks? I doubt it.

counterargument: who cares bc he's 31 when this deal ends.
0 x

CP_414
All-Star
Posts: 1835
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2004 5:29 pm
x 6
x 11

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby CP_414 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:27 pm

Cubswin11 wrote:
CP_414 wrote:
Again, i personally am not opposed to this deal. I just don't think it's a hot take to be puzzled by this. A reasonable person can look at this and say that it's not a good idea. That doesn't mean they are correct. It just means it's a fair take.

Will you think this isn't a good deal if we sign Ohtani then bring in 1 or 2 AAAA filler types (Garza, Gee, Buchholz, etc)? Or if the 6-man rotation has some legs and we add Cobb and Ohtani? Or if we trade for a SP of a Cobb level? If you think this is our only significant SP add of the offseason then I get the hate/worry but I highly doubt it is and very well could be the "worst" pitcher we add.


I don't think it's a bad deal right now. I am not saying it's a bad deal. I'm saying it's not crazy to be opposed to this.

I fully expect them to add a starting pitcher much better than Chatwood, whether it's Ohtani or someone else.
Last edited by CP_414 on Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
0 x

User avatar
David
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 60783
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 12:33 am
Location: Chicago
x 7884
x 4785

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby David » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:27 pm

basically everything about that question from derwood was weird as horsefeathers but i ignored it because i didn't want to pile on him more
0 x
Image

The Cubs’ transaction list under Epstein and Hoyer reads like a work of fiction, a wish-fulfillment list composed in hindsight.

User avatar
jersey cubs fan
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 58859
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:38 pm
Location: Hoboken squat cobbler
x 2383
x 8059

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby jersey cubs fan » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:29 pm

David wrote:basically everything about that question from derwood was weird as horsefeathers but i ignored it because i didn't want to pile on him more


David just scooting on past a chance to pile on derwood
Image
12 x
longhotsummer wrote:I realize now, any opposing viewpoint, will not be tolerated.

User avatar
weis21
5-Time All-Star
Posts: 8864
Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 6:45 am
Location: ECU
x 5562
x 1108

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby weis21 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:30 pm

i'm just glad he got both TJS outta the way already, personally.
0 x

CP_414
All-Star
Posts: 1835
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2004 5:29 pm
x 6
x 11

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby CP_414 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:37 pm

David wrote:
ScrubMD wrote:
CP_414 wrote: less than 1 WAR per season


Where are you getting this?


5.1 fWAR in 6 "seasons"

but fWAR doesn't like GB guys who don't strike many out.


Do you think that's a flaw with fWAR or do you think that's a flaw with guys who don't strike many out?
0 x

User avatar
Banedon
Curse You!
Posts: 66361
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:36 pm
Location: Kidding Myself
x 5071
x 5041

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Banedon » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:38 pm

0 x
Image

User avatar
David
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 60783
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 12:33 am
Location: Chicago
x 7884
x 4785

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby David » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:39 pm

CP_414 wrote:
David wrote:
ScrubMD wrote:
Where are you getting this?


5.1 fWAR in 6 "seasons"

but fWAR doesn't like GB guys who don't strike many out.


Do you think that's a flaw with fWAR or do you think that's a flaw with guys who don't strike many out?


I don't think it's a flaw with anything. I just think fWAR/FIP can't be blindly applied and FIP beaters do exist.
0 x
Image

The Cubs’ transaction list under Epstein and Hoyer reads like a work of fiction, a wish-fulfillment list composed in hindsight.

CP_414
All-Star
Posts: 1835
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2004 5:29 pm
x 6
x 11

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby CP_414 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:41 pm

David wrote:
CP_414 wrote:
David wrote:
5.1 fWAR in 6 "seasons"

but fWAR doesn't like GB guys who don't strike many out.


Do you think that's a flaw with fWAR or do you think that's a flaw with guys who don't strike many out?


I don't think it's a flaw with anything. I just think fWAR/FIP can't be blindly applied and FIP beaters do exist.


Is Chatwood a FIP beater? His ERA is pretty close to his FIP and almost identical to his xFIP for his career. It looks to me like he's getting the results that he has deserved to this point.
0 x

User avatar
David
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 60783
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 12:33 am
Location: Chicago
x 7884
x 4785

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby David » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:43 pm

CP_414 wrote:
David wrote:
CP_414 wrote:
Do you think that's a flaw with fWAR or do you think that's a flaw with guys who don't strike many out?


I don't think it's a flaw with anything. I just think fWAR/FIP can't be blindly applied and FIP beaters do exist.


Is Chatwood a FIP beater? His ERA is pretty close to his FIP and almost identical to his xFIP for his career. It looks to me like he's getting the results that he has deserved to this point.


I didn't say that anywhere.

I was explaining the reason for the discrepancy between his fWAR and his bWAR
0 x
Image

The Cubs’ transaction list under Epstein and Hoyer reads like a work of fiction, a wish-fulfillment list composed in hindsight.

User avatar
TomtheBombadil
5-Time All-Star
Posts: 5642
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 8:35 pm
x 364
x 457

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby TomtheBombadil » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:44 pm

jersey cubs fan wrote:it's weird to me that people can't see the argument for this signing being puzzling, or not all that intriguing.


Agreed even as someone who doesn’t outright dislike it.
0 x
Spoiler: show
Image

User avatar
David
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 60783
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 12:33 am
Location: Chicago
x 7884
x 4785

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby David » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:46 pm

TomtheBombadil wrote:
jersey cubs fan wrote:it's weird to me that people can't see the argument for this signing being puzzling, or not all that intriguing.


Agreed even as someone who doesn’t outright dislike it.



TomtheBombadil wrote:Solid as a muh

Honestly just on pure dollars I prefer this to Cobb. Neither is an innings eater or an ace, might as well pick the cheaper one and let them coast in front of this offense for as many innings as they’ve got.


am i the only one who thinks "solid as a muh" and "don't outright dislike" mean very different things, even in the way of subjective statements that are open to interpretation?
2 x
Image

The Cubs’ transaction list under Epstein and Hoyer reads like a work of fiction, a wish-fulfillment list composed in hindsight.

CP_414
All-Star
Posts: 1835
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2004 5:29 pm
x 6
x 11

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby CP_414 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:47 pm

David wrote:
CP_414 wrote:
David wrote:
I don't think it's a flaw with anything. I just think fWAR/FIP can't be blindly applied and FIP beaters do exist.


Is Chatwood a FIP beater? His ERA is pretty close to his FIP and almost identical to his xFIP for his career. It looks to me like he's getting the results that he has deserved to this point.


I didn't say that anywhere.

I was explaining the reason for the discrepancy between his fWAR and his bWAR


Gotcha. Because you said fWAR doesn't like GB pitchers who don't strike everyone out I took it as you thinking that bWAR was more accurate for a player like Chatwood. So I'm just saying that fWAR is probably correct to not like pitchers who don't strike many out and who walk a lot, but I misinterpreted what you were saying.
0 x

User avatar
JudasIscariotTheBird
All-Star
Posts: 3293
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2003 6:05 am
Location: Denver, CO
x 3052
x 1310

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:47 pm

CP_414 wrote:
David wrote:
CP_414 wrote:
Do you think that's a flaw with fWAR or do you think that's a flaw with guys who don't strike many out?


I don't think it's a flaw with anything. I just think fWAR/FIP can't be blindly applied and FIP beaters do exist.


Is Chatwood a FIP beater? His ERA is pretty close to his FIP and almost identical to his xFIP for his career. It looks to me like he's getting the results that he has deserved to this point.

...did I mention he pitches in Coors?
0 x
"None of these signal alarm bells to me"-Boris
"Sublime was driven by their frontman, who was, quite probably, a musical savant." -RIP Stannis
(Formerly Diceman4221)

Bruno7481
All-Star
Posts: 4282
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2003 10:04 pm
x 2
x 35

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Bruno7481 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:49 pm

For every positive thing I find (statcast data, GB rate) there is something that offsets it (walk rate, strikeout rate). But, that is probably true for every 5th starter in the league.

Can’t really say if I like it, but I don’t hate it. How’s that for analysis?

I trust the research and analysis capability of the FO though.
Last edited by Bruno7481 on Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
0 x

CP_414
All-Star
Posts: 1835
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2004 5:29 pm
x 6
x 11

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby CP_414 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:53 pm

DiceMan4221 wrote:
CP_414 wrote:
David wrote:
I don't think it's a flaw with anything. I just think fWAR/FIP can't be blindly applied and FIP beaters do exist.


Is Chatwood a FIP beater? His ERA is pretty close to his FIP and almost identical to his xFIP for his career. It looks to me like he's getting the results that he has deserved to this point.

...did I mention he pitches in Coors?


Did i mention his road peripherals? That's what this whole thing is about. The guy wrote that his road peripherals are not much better than his home ones.
0 x

CP_414
All-Star
Posts: 1835
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2004 5:29 pm
x 6
x 11

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby CP_414 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:55 pm

Bruno7481 wrote:For every positive thing I find (statcast data, GB rate) there is something that offsets it (walk rate, strikeout rate).

Can’t really say if I like it, but I don’t hate it. How’s that for analysis?

I trust the research and analysis capability of the FO though.


Agreed. I see why people are excited about his potential. I see why people think this isn't smart.
0 x

User avatar
TomtheBombadil
5-Time All-Star
Posts: 5642
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 8:35 pm
x 364
x 457

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby TomtheBombadil » Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:01 pm

David wrote:
TomtheBombadil wrote:
jersey cubs fan wrote:it's weird to me that people can't see the argument for this signing being puzzling, or not all that intriguing.


Agreed even as someone who doesn’t outright dislike it.



TomtheBombadil wrote:Solid as a muh

Honestly just on pure dollars I prefer this to Cobb. Neither is an innings eater or an ace, might as well pick the cheaper one and let them coast in front of this offense for as many innings as they’ve got.


am i the only one who thinks "solid as a muh" and "don't outright dislike" mean very different things, even in the way of subjective statements that are open to interpretation?


No, that was just more token sloppy and hurried posting.
1 x
Spoiler: show
Image

User avatar
Cubswin11
Hall of Fame
Posts: 22790
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:17 pm
x 5840
x 4391

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Cubswin11 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:24 pm

11 x
Screw Pitchers

Post Count Padder
Superstar
Posts: 14799
Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2003 8:51 pm
Location: In your dreams
x 36
x 145

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Post Count Padder » Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:30 pm

The way I see it, getting him away from Coors is a huge help, and being a ground ball pitcher helps in Wrigley. And he's an upgrade on John Lackey.
0 x
formerly known as PriorPower
formerly known as the guy with Huston Street in his sig

:flythew:

User avatar
Banedon
Curse You!
Posts: 66361
Joined: Wed Jun 18, 2003 9:36 pm
Location: Kidding Myself
x 5071
x 5041

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Banedon » Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:49 pm

Cubswin11 wrote:


That's closer to knowing his name then Javy will ever get.
3 x
Image

User avatar
Cubswin11
Hall of Fame
Posts: 22790
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:17 pm
x 5840
x 4391

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Cubswin11 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:03 pm

Theo always gets his man

0 x
Screw Pitchers

User avatar
Derwood
Stall Monitor
Posts: 68146
Joined: Thu Jul 10, 2003 4:44 pm
Location: 375 Miles East of Wrigley
x 1004
x 1938

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Derwood » Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:11 pm

David wrote:basically everything about that question from derwood was weird as horsefeathers but i ignored it because i didn't want to pile on him more


I know nothing about him, so I was just curious. Why is that weird?
0 x

User avatar
UMFan83
Inner-Circle HOF
Posts: 76998
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2003 8:42 pm
Location: Southport Ave
x 2734
x 4112
Contact:

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby UMFan83 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:22 pm

Cubswin11 wrote:

I’m glad Miggy showed him the right way to tweet before he left.
1 x
Win it for Fred

User avatar
Sammy Sofa
Licks Butts
Posts: 77513
Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 3:45 am
Location: Washington DC
x 9753
x 12885

Re: Cubs sign Tyler Chatwood for 3/$38M

Postby Sammy Sofa » Fri Dec 08, 2017 12:42 am

Banedon wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:


That's closer to knowing his name then Javy will ever get.


Man, with a name like that he totally just thinks he's messaging another porn star.
8 x
► Show Spoiler


Return to “Transactions”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bear Cub, Google Adsense [Bot] and 4 guests