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The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:47 pm
by Sammy Sofa
Stew in your hot goss here, you filthy reprobates.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:50 pm
by Hairyducked Idiot
I want Harper for the sheer swag of it all.

Otherwise, just throw all your resources at the bullpen. Just give any five turds to be your starters and have an unbeatable bullpen.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:53 pm
by Sammy Sofa
Hairyducked Idiot wrote:I want Harper for the sheer swag of it all.

Otherwise, just throw all your resources at the bullpen. Just give any five turds to be your starters and have an unbeatable bullpen.


I'm also getting more and more onboard with the idea of bullpen-ing it as much as possible. I'd still like to add one more starter just to have some depth, but beyond that and Harper or Machado, just amp up the bullpen numbers and see what sticks. And start pushing what few pitching prospects they have into the bullpen sooner rather than later.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:55 pm
by Brian
We have to convince Duensing to retire and Kintzler to not pick up his option

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:57 pm
by Sammys Boombox
On the record as no for Harper.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:01 pm
by Cubswin11
Sammys Boombox wrote:On the record as no for Harper.

Like you don’t want him or don’t think we get him?

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:02 pm
by TBS Playoffs Insider
Jed Lowrie seems like a good bet as a target.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:06 pm
by Cubswin11
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:Jed Lowrie seems like a good bet as a target.

Lowrie, Mercer, Marwin and Eduardo Escobar all seem like some logical targets. Profar would be a fun trade target too depending on what they try to do, he finally was healthy and figured it out this year but he’s already in arbitration I think and they might be rebuilding a bit.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:07 pm
by Brian
Am I crazy to think that Mills could be a key bullpen arm next year? To me he looked great in the big leagues this year outside of that first inning of the Mets start

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:08 pm
by Sammy Sofa
Brian wrote:Am I crazy to think that Mills could be a key bullpen arm next year? To me he looked great in the big leagues this year outside of that first inning of the Mets start


I also threw this out there a couple times and I don't think I ever got a reply; to my dimwit eyes, I thought he looked at least reasonably promising.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:09 pm
by Cubswin11
Brian wrote:Am I crazy to think that Mills could be a key bullpen arm next year? To me he looked great in the big leagues this year outside of that first inning of the Mets start

Depending the other moves I’d think they’d want him to be in Iowa as the 7/8th starter depth option. But yeah his curve seems legit, his Fb in theory plays up in the pen. It’s not a bad idea.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:11 pm
by The_Achiever
I too would like a super bullpen. Also need to fix the offense, no big deal for one off season, eh.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:13 pm
by TBS Playoffs Insider
if you can get elite bullpen innings out of jesse chavez, it's at least in the realm of possibilities that alec mills can be kinda good for 50 innings or so if used properly

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:15 pm
by Cubswin11
The_Achiever wrote:I too would like a super bullpen. Also need to fix the offense, no big deal for one off season, eh.

Adding 1-2 guys to each unit and expecting some better health and bounce backs should do it. Granted one of those guys is Bryce horsefeathering Harper, but yeah. A lot of the answers probably are on the team, I’d guess.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:16 pm
by Cubswin11
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:if you can get elite bullpen innings out of jesse chavez, it's at least in the realm of possibilities that alec mills can be kinda good for 50 innings or so if used properly

I want Chavez back, give him a Duensing type deal to lower the LT hit.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:20 pm
by Cubswin11
I don’t know how you would entirely make it work from a roster construction stand point but I really would be interested in going with a 6-man rotation next year. Seems like it could be a way to help mitigate some innings and keep guys fresh. Though I guess all the SP got better once they had innings under the belt this year so who knows. But it would seem to help some guys with where they are at in age (Lester) and health (Darvish who might be on a bit of an innings limit).

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:24 pm
by TBS Playoffs Insider
Cubswin11 wrote:
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:if you can get elite bullpen innings out of jesse chavez, it's at least in the realm of possibilities that alec mills can be kinda good for 50 innings or so if used properly

I want Chavez back, give him a Duensing type deal to lower the LT hit.


and also kill duensing

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:30 pm
by weis21
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:if you can get elite bullpen innings out of jesse chavez, it's at least in the realm of possibilities that alec mills can be kinda good for 50 innings or so if used properly

i'd throw allen webster's name in that mix, too, along with mills

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:34 pm
by Tim
Posting this from the other thread with some tweaks due to events since that time (mainly Russell)


Exercise options on:

- Quintana
- Strop

Trade:

- Duensing, Kintzler for whatever savings can be had (assume we can save $2M while paying the rest) for lottery tickets
- LaStella for relief prospect?
- Russell+ for the best pre-arb reliever that can be had. For the sake of argument, since Philly has really struggled getting Crawford to produce, I'll go with Russell+ for Seranthony Dominguez. This also saves $4-5M

Sign:

- Bryce Harper
- Craig Kimbrel
- Justin Wilson


Lineup: Contreras / Rizzo / Zobrist / Baez / Bryant / Schwarber / Heyward / Harper
Bench: Happ / Almora / Caratini / Bote
Rotation: Darvish / Lester / Hendricks / Quintana / Smyly
Swing: Monty / Chatwood / Mills
Bullpen: Kimbrel / Morrow / Strop / Dominguez / Edwards / Cishek / Wilson
Shuttle: Maples / Mekkes / Webster / Rosario / Norwood / Alzolay / etc

Okay, so let's talk about the SP first - while I really appreciate what we've gotten from Hamels, I am not sure about committing $20M to him next year. And even though it shouldn't really matter, I feel like we have too many similar pitchers in Lester, Hamels & Quintana. We'll have a three way competition in spring training between Smyly, Monty and Chatwood for the final rotation spot. I'll go with Smyly actually being healthy out of ST and winning the job to start the year. The other two give us solid backup plans along with the parade of depth guys we're building in AA & AAA.

Harper is a no brainer, of course. When you have a chance to add a generational talent, you do it.

Trading Russell is pretty much a must at this point. From a baseball perspective, I strongly believe that he is who has shown himself to be - a 2.5-4 win player on an annual basis. For that kind of value, I think there are teams out there that will be willing to take on the headache (depending on the ultimate findings from MLB, of course). We might have to add from our bevy of mid-level prospects, but that's okay. For the return, I want a quality reliever that has proven himself in MLB, but is still well pre-arb. Just for the idea of a return, I threw Seranthony Dominguez out there. JP Crawford has really struggled in the bigs so far and is nowhere near as good defensively as Russell. Philly has money to spend and they believe that their window starts now, so Russell's increasing costs shouldn't bother them that much and they'll still get three years of control. Meanwhile Dominguez has broken into the majors with solid performance in 2018 and still has six years of control remaining.

The biggest (baseball) problem with this deal is the timing. I think Philly will be pushing hard for Machado and wouldn't make this trade until that's resolved. On our end, we'll have to wait for MLB to conclude its investigation and determine Russell's fate before we could make a move. It may end up that the Cubs just need to non-tender Russell. In which case, sub Happ in here for Addison - Philly's OF production sucked last year, too.

On a side note, we may need to also sign a backup SS. If only Short had made a bit more contact and hit for a bit more average this year I'd be more willing to roll with him at Iowa and an occasional call-up to give Javy a blow. Signing a backup SS would pretty much "seal" LaStella's fate, meaning he would have to be traded for whatever flyer we could get in return. When we market him, we should mention Scooter Gennett. Often.

To complete the team, we overload the pen. Kimbrel will be expensive as hell, but he's been incredibly durable, hasn't shown many signs of decline and is a force at the end of games. Let's stop messing around with it and just sign him to be the man. Wilson has shown himself to be reliable in the second half of this year and provides some left handed heat from the pen. The list above looks light on lefties, but is bolstered by Monty / Smyly. Not to mention that there's a bunch of guys on that list that are tough on both lefties and righties. I'll just count on Morrow spending a lot of time on the DL during the year and we rotate other guys through there to keep guys rested as we go. I trust the front office to fit 15+ pitchers onto the 25 man roster somehow.

I thought about Miller instead of Kimbrel, but he's older, was injured this year and has been tailing off each of the past couple years. I know others prefer to invest elsewhere given the depth of the market. I get that. I could be convinced to go that direction, too. I just don't see any other names on that list that inspire the same kind of warm and fuzzy thoughts of "now THIS is something even Joe can't screw up". I also looked at lefties other than Wilson and didn't see anyone there that inspired me, but I'm happy to go a different direction there.

RE: the Shuttle - I'm pretty sure that Mills performance down the stretch has him making the team in 2019. I believe he's out of options anyway, so if they want him in the org, they'll have to find room for him. Let us all say our prayers all offseason long that Maples & Mekkes develop a miraculous increase in control/command this winter (add in Edwards, too, I guess).

In summary, the OF defense is questionable (at best) and there's some collapse potential in the rotation, even with the multiple backup options. But the super pen should allow the team to shorten the game and keep the starters from seeing the heart of the order too many times in the same game. With the multiple options available in Tenn & Iowa next year, we should be able to use a few phantom DL stints to get guys some rest, too.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:40 pm
by TBS Playoffs Insider
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:if you can get elite bullpen innings out of jesse chavez, it's at least in the realm of possibilities that alec mills can be kinda good for 50 innings or so if used properly

I want Chavez back, give him a Duensing type deal to lower the LT hit.


and also kill duensing


can you imagine how horsefeathers up it would be to be dumpy old brian duensing and have the one thing you're remotely good at in life be "being a part of the small population of left handed people who is part of the even smaller group of lefthanded people who can throw curveballs to the even smaller portion of people who bat left handed" and then read online where some dumbass is like "he should be murdered" and other people are liking the post like "yes i agree, murder is a fitting outcome for him."

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:42 pm
by Sammy Sofa
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:I want Chavez back, give him a Duensing type deal to lower the LT hit.


and also kill duensing


can you imagine how horsefeathers up it would be to be dumpy old brian duensing and have the one thing you're remotely good at in life be "being a part of the small population of left handed people who is part of the even smaller group of lefthanded people who can throw curveballs to the even smaller portion of people who bat left handed" and then read online where some dumbass is like "he should be murdered" and other people are liking the post like "yes i agree, murder is a fitting outcome for him."


All fans of everything are terrible. We should be marched off of a cliff.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:48 pm
by davell
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:Jed Lowrie seems like a good bet as a target.


I think I've read he actually wants to stay put and they want him back too. Money talks and all caveats obviously.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 8:22 pm
by Old Style
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:
Cubswin11 wrote:
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:if you can get elite bullpen innings out of jesse chavez, it's at least in the realm of possibilities that alec mills can be kinda good for 50 innings or so if used properly

I want Chavez back, give him a Duensing type deal to lower the LT hit.


and also kill duensing

Image

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 8:24 pm
by Duke Silver
Sammy Sofa wrote:
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:
TBS Playoffs Insider wrote:
and also kill duensing


can you imagine how horsefeathers up it would be to be dumpy old brian duensing and have the one thing you're remotely good at in life be "being a part of the small population of left handed people who is part of the even smaller group of lefthanded people who can throw curveballs to the even smaller portion of people who bat left handed" and then read online where some dumbass is like "he should be murdered" and other people are liking the post like "yes i agree, murder is a fitting outcome for him."


All fans of everything are terrible. We should be marched off of a cliff.


Hmm... I bet Brian Duensing is a fan of something.

Re: The 2018-2019 Cubs Offseason Rumors & Discussion Thread - "On wrongs swift vengeance waits..."

Posted: Wed Oct 03, 2018 8:24 pm
by badger
How hard is it going to be to trade a guy who's suspended for 40 games and is pretty much a defense-only player?