Politics & Current Events

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:52 am

Bluescale wrote:
Hairyducked Idiot wrote:She was actively campaigning against civil unions (let alone gay marriage) barely a decade ago and she still talks about gay rights as being a threat to religious freedom. She has a weird affinity for hard-right international leaders. She probably belongs to a weird cult but has managed to scrub any proof of a hard connection.


Since 2012 she's supported same-sex marriage. She's a Hindu, so if you want to consider that a cult, feel free to rock that stance.

Her biggest remaining problem (as far as I can tell) is her questionable attitude toward Muslims. That's something she'll hopefully have to confront in the primaries.


The Krishna cult she used to belong to still provides an awful lot of financial support to her.

Officially supporting same-sex marriage while warning judges to guard against religious persecution when protecting gay rights.

And again, she is weirdly supportive of hard-right international leaders.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby minnesotacubsfan » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:55 am

This is stupid, this argument about one female candidate vs another. Its quality vs quantity stupid. Quantity IS a quality. Lets get a horsefeathers ton to choose from.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:59 am

minnesotacubsfan wrote:This is stupid, this argument about one female candidate vs another. Its quality vs quantity stupid. Quantity IS a quality. Lets get a horsefeathers ton to choose from.


I’m fine with Warren, Harris, Klubacher, whoever.


Gabbard is a weirdo conservative who runs as a Dem for who knows why
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Sat Jan 12, 2019 2:59 am

minnesotacubsfan wrote:This is stupid, this argument about one female candidate vs another. Its quality vs quantity stupid. Quantity IS a quality. Lets get a horsefeathers ton to choose from.


I’m fine with Warren, Harris, Klubacher, whoever.


Gabbard is a weirdo conservative who runs as a Dem for who knows why
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Bluescale » Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:07 am

Hairyducked Idiot wrote:
minnesotacubsfan wrote:This is stupid, this argument about one female candidate vs another. Its quality vs quantity stupid. Quantity IS a quality. Lets get a horsefeathers ton to choose from.


I’m fine with Warren, Harris, Klubacher, whoever.


Gabbard is a weirdo conservative who runs as a Dem for who knows why


No she's not. Take a look at her actual recent voting record vs. forming your opinion based on someone's hot take on her:

http://www.ontheissues.org/house/tulsi_gabbard.htm

Are there some problematic things about her? Yep. Does that mean it's anything less than awesome that she's running? Nope.

I'm not waiting for a political unicorn who's been perfect from day 1. I want a bunch of candidates to choose from, and the more of them that are women and minorities, the better.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Derwood » Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:40 am

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Derwood » Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:43 am

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Banedon » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:00 am

To be fair, she's outright denounced David Duke's support.

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby TruffleShuffle » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:53 am

is this bad? it seems bad.

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby TruffleShuffle » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:31 am

i'm much less concerned about gabbard's reaction to right-wing racists than i am that they saw reason to praise her.

horsefeathers gabbard. her attitude towards terrorism is just as vacuous as any right-wing loser ("they hate us because of their religion and because of our freedoms") and her attitude towards muslims is pretty well in line with steve bannon. plus she cozies up to mass-murdering autocrats and casts doubt on their crimes. i'll write in gritty before i vote for her.

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby CubInOK » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:31 am

Gabbard supports everything Bashar al-Assad.

I’m not going to say Gabbard is alt-right. I am going to say the alt-right is saying she’s alt-right.

I don’t want another Russian asset as my president.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby TruffleShuffle » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:48 am

this is a good point.

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:15 am

minnesotacubsfan wrote:This is stupid, this argument about one female candidate vs another. Its quality vs quantity stupid. Quantity IS a quality. Lets get a horsefeathers ton to choose from.


Bluescale wrote:I'm not waiting for a political unicorn who's been perfect from day 1. I want a bunch of candidates to choose from, and the more of them that are women and minorities, the better.


We're seeing these kinds of takes/accusations a LOT, and they're not helpful.

Gabbard has, IMO, some GIGANTIC red flags that have absolutely nothing to do with here being or woman, or even remotely come close to passing some kind of ridiculously unfair purity test. Her LGBTQ track record basically now amounts to, at best, that she tolerates "those people." She is very, VERY different from when it was, rightly, pointed out how people like Obama and Clinton had a very clear track record of how they changed their public rhetoric and support of something like gay marriage; Gabbard essentially claimed to reverse her position on a dime a mere 5 years ago, and even that came with some pretty explicit caveats, and then little more than mostly just simply not addressing the LBTQ side of the Left as much as possible (which is REALLY hard to do as a horsefeathering Democrat in horsefeathering Hawaii). Given how vocally opposed she was to LGBTQ rights until then, and compounded how bizarre that it is given that she's a liberal from, again, horsefeathering Hawaii, and further compounded how she continued to or even still has people on her staff who almost definitely share the same anti-LGBTQ sentiments (a la Ron Paul's always classic, "I'M not a racist; I just happen to employee people who are because of coincidences!"), this is a HUGE something that will be an unavoidable issue for someone running for president as a Democrat, and it has zilch to do with her being a woman or some unrealistic sense of ideological "purity;" it's basic human decency that we should expect from everyone, and especially as the BARE MINIMUM from self-proclaimed Democrats/liberals/progressives.

And Kyle is, IMO, 100% right to call her out as being tied to a cult, because she completely is. The attempts to deflect this by her and her staff to try and shame everyone criticizing her over this as being anti-Hindu is total BS; the Krishnas are a cult, and the sect she is intrinsically linked to, the Science of Identity, is REALLY a horsefeathering cult (plus nevermind that the only real Hindu aspect to her is how much she approaches scary things like nationalism and Islamophobia with a distinctly Hindutva zeal). They are deeply ingrained in her entire life and her political machine; her Chief of Staff is still this bizarre babyfaced nobody with zero political staff experience who came right from them. This longform deep dive into her relationship with them that I read last year should rightly scare anyone who reads it into thinking she'd have a shred of a chance once it reaches the national stage:

https://www.meanwhileinhawaii.org/home/ ... si-gabbard

And all of that is without getting to her MASSIVELY problematic approaches towards and attitudes/rhetoric on Islam and the Middle East (ESPECIALLY about Iran). Or stuff like her very vocal pro-Putin, pro-Assad rhetoric. She's like if the bogeyman hawk version of Hillary Clinton people kept crying about and John Bolton had a baby.

Personally, I think her shot is dead in the water. She's got way too many poison pills that are going to pop up and torpedo her. I'm very wary of why she's even trying this in the current political climate on the Left in the first place. This can't help but kinda seem like Jill Stein on a larger scale.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:36 pm

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby CyHawk_Cub » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:20 pm

Yeah, I'm trying to tread carefully, internally at least, about my attitudes concerning the Dem field. I simply cannot uncritically endorse someone because they're minority/female/Dem. Gabbard has issues I cannot overlook nor accept. That is all. I look forward to the vetting process.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Sat Jan 12, 2019 4:30 pm

Sammy Sofa wrote:
Personally, I think her shot is dead in the water. She's got way too many poison pills that are going to pop up and torpedo her. I'm very wary of why she's even trying this in the current political climate on the Left in the first place. This can't help but kinda seem like Jill Stein on a larger scale.

The problem arises when there are very large numbers of candiates in nation-wide elections. Now, most of the time the best (funded?) campaigner/candidate just rises to the top and wins. But sometimes you just have the vote split multiple ways by largely-indistiguishable candidates. In that case, the more you stick out and the more noise you make and the more devoted and crazed your base is, then the more TV time you get...and then the more votes you acquire simply by momentum. You know which campaign I'm referencing here. All of these "poison pills" aren't quite so poisonous if if 12% of the population has built up an immunity, and 12% is all you need to get the ball rolling and a seat at the table. Jill Stein running against a bunch of left-leaners would scare the bejeezus out of me. In a case like that, I'd find cold comfort that the DNC would do its best to look like a big tent while it also did its best to torpedo her campaign as it got close toward the end...
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:09 pm

I'm sorry, but nobody's built up an "immunity" to a presidential candidate raised in a cult and who runs a staff filled with cult members. Her campaign, IMO, is dead in the water once this gets any kind of traction. Compound that with how much funky money she has flowing in...I seriously question her motives in doing this. She sizes up more to be some kind of chaos agent than anything resembling a legit candidate given how barely you have to scratch below the surface (and plenty of times not even that) to find why she is wholly unfit for this. It's THAT combined with the shady money/connections money behind her that has me thinking of someone like Stein (or even Trump).
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby CubinNY » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:09 pm

TruffleShuffle wrote:is this bad? it seems bad.


These selective leaks are brilliant. The Information is out there, news people are going to talk about it and Trump is going to give Mueller more evidence.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:15 pm

Sammy Sofa wrote:I'm sorry, but nobody's built up an "immunity" to a presidential candidate raised in a cult and who runs a staff filled with cult members. Her campaign, IMO, is dead in the water once this gets any kind of traction. Compound that with how much funky money she has flowing in...I seriously question her motives in doing this. She sizes up more to be some kind of chaos agent than anything resembling a legit candidate given how barely you have to scratch below the surface (and plenty of times not even that) to find why she is wholly unfit for this. It's THAT combined with the shady money/connections money behind her that has me thinking of someone like Stein (or even Trump).

...so you think because she has similarities to Trump she CAN'T make headway in a large-field primary?! Look, Trump sure as horsefeathers isn't a Christian and still managed to get the evangelical support. This lady can just throw away her crazy cult membership, keep mentioning how much she hates Muslims, maybe a dashof anti-vax non-sense, and rack up 10% of the people who call themselves Democrats.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Sammy Sofa » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:27 pm

JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:...so you think because she has similarities to Trump she CAN'T make headway in a large-field primary?!


I think she has similarities to Trump in that she has seriously questionable interests and money backing her.

Look, Trump sure as horsefeathers isn't a Christian and still managed to get the evangelical support.


OK? If he was a lifelong Scientologist he wouldn't have, which is really what we're essentially dealing with here. Read the first link I provided when you have the time.

This lady can just throw away her crazy cult membership


She can't; they make up a ton of her money, and surround her via her family and staff.

She's toast.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby CyHawk_Cub » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:49 pm

If Gabbard has Mark Burnett (or someone of his ilk) create a reality show based on a fake perception of her as ultra-successful, then yeah, then maybe she can be like Trump**. Beyond that, no. I agree w/ mojo. This has the smell of a 3rd party candidacy all over it. JMO. I find very little of substance that is appealing about her.

**no, not really, just kidding
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Ding Dong Johnson » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:07 pm

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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby CubinNY » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:17 pm

Sammy Sofa wrote:
JudasIscariotTheBird wrote:...so you think because she has similarities to Trump she CAN'T make headway in a large-field primary?!


I think she has similarities to Trump in that she has seriously questionable interests and money backing her.

Look, Trump sure as horsefeathers isn't a Christian and still managed to get the evangelical support.


OK? If he was a lifelong Scientologist he wouldn't have, which is really what we're essentially dealing with here. Read the first link I provided when you have the time.

This lady can just throw away her crazy cult membership


She can't; they make up a ton of her money, and surround her via her family and staff.

She's toast.

She’s running to make money, not to win.
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby Hairyducked Idiot » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:24 pm

Fun reminder that we are less than two months away from another debt ceiling fight
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Re: Politics & Current Events

Postby JudasIscariotTheBird » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:28 pm

CubinNY wrote:She’s running to make money, not to win.

I want to beat a dead horse here. This has recent precedent.
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